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Discussion Starter #1
Cost almost two thousand dollars, when I can buy a TomTom for $200? I think Staples has them for $150 today on sale.
Is the vehicle system 10 times better? 10 times more expensive to build into the vehicle? Is there a far better antenne? Does it come with an annual map upgrade or something?

Yes, the screens are different sizes and integration into the vehicle is nice, but not $1800 nice.

On the 08's can I replace the factory radio with a standard aftermarket, or is it hopelessly trapped in the MOST system? There are aftermarket radios with bluetooth and navigation for less than the factory system.
 

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Because car companies think they can rip you off. If they charged an ACCEPTABLE price, perhaps a little more than say a tom-tom, people would buy them no problem.

Instead, very few elect to purchase them.
 

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I agree, this is a total rip off. Recently when we were shopping for our 9-3, my wife and I discussed this at great length. The indash NAV does not make sense for the price. Yes it's nice to have it integrated, but, like you said, not $2000 nice. Plus you can take your Garmin or Tomtom and walk with it, for example, while visiting Chicago or NYC, or take it in your rental car or your other cars which may not have a NAV system either. Much more versitile.

I think GM overinflates the price of the NAV system b/c they want to promote OnStar b/c they've sunk so much $$ into this system. Sadly, I have yet to meet an OnStar user who really finds much value in the system.
 

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Nickshu said:
I think GM overinflates the price of the NAV system b/c they want to promote OnStar b/c they've sunk so much $$ into this system. Sadly, I have yet to meet an OnStar user who really finds much value in the system.

2K is about the price ALL car manuf. are asking for NAV units. I had one in my Jaguar X-type and the NAV unit was great. 11 inch touch screen that also controlled air con and radio/cd all by touch screen. well worth the 2500.00 option that I paid.
 

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twarner776 said:
2K is about the price ALL car manuf. are asking for NAV units. I had one in my Jaguar X-type and the NAV unit was great. 11 inch touch screen that also controlled air con and radio/cd all by touch screen. well worth the 2500.00 option that I paid.
We had ones in both our Jaguar X-Type and our S-Type R ... you're right: GREAT units!! The Chrysler unit in our Jeep is also great, although it does not have a touch screen which means data input is a real pain!!

OK let's try these reasons why the cost is higher:

-Larger, and therefore more expensive, screens
-Built-in management of not only navigation, but also all audio functions. Add in the costs of the CD player, radio, etc.
-Connections to the car's "innards" which allow movement to be shown when there is no satellite signal available (for example in a tunnel or a dead spot). I believe the in-dash units also have inertial measuring units as well to assist with this process.
-Less units are manufactured resulting in a higher cost per unit
-Longer, more thorough warranty
-Significantly more legal liability reserve (if you're stupid and mess with the unit while you're driving and have an accident, GM is a much more likely target for you to sue rather than a small company like Tom-tom) ... and people (in the USA) WILL sue!!

There are probably others as well.

By the way, although it may appear I'm giving GM a bit of slack here, that doesn't mean that I wouldn't like to see a faster processor and more memory in the units ... and definitely I'd prefer to have a BT capability in addition to OnStar. Other manufacturers are able to do that (Ford's new Sync is awesome in this regard, as is Chrysler's MyGig) so I would expect GM to do the same.

Cheers!!

Ken
 
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Missileman said:
OK let's try these reasons why the cost is higher:

-Larger, and therefore more expensive, screens
-Built-in management of not only navigation, but also all audio functions. Add in the costs of the CD player, radio, etc.
-Connections to the car's "innards" which allow movement to be shown when there is no satellite signal available (for example in a tunnel or a dead spot). I believe the in-dash units also have inertial measuring units as well to assist with this process.
-Less units are manufactured resulting in a higher cost per unit
-Longer, more thorough warranty
-Significantly more legal liability reserve (if you're stupid and mess with the unit while you're driving and have an accident, GM is a much more likely target for you to sue rather than a small company like Tom-tom) ... and people (in the USA) WILL sue!!
I appreciate your effort Missileman but...

-Larger, and therefore more expensive, screens
With mass manufacturing, maybe a $50 cost difference?

-Built-in management of not only navigation, but also all audio functions. Add in the costs of the CD player, radio, etc.
The cost of the nav unit is in addition to the standard radio and cd player.

-Connections to the car's "innards" which allow movement to be shown when there is no satellite signal available (for example in a tunnel or a dead spot). I believe the in-dash units also have inertial measuring units as well to assist with this process.
My TomTom does the same. It looks like it uses the speed of the car before you went into a tunnel and calculates where you are along the projected path.

-Less units are manufactured resulting in a higher cost per unit
GM is huge and the largest car manufacturer in the world. If they would lower the price of their standard nav unit found in all their vehicles, perhaps more people would actually get it. They already invested in development of the unit, maps etc. The actual production costs couldn't be more than a few hundred $?

-Longer, more thorough warranty
Good point

-Significantly more legal liability reserve
I am sure the other navigation manufacturers have the same liability issues.

If you want to get the nav unit on the 2008 models, it is actually $2,145. If I remember correctly, the cost on the 2007 models was $2000 plus the cost of $800 for Onstar because it was required for the nav unit.. :eek:

My TomTom I bought for about $500 last year:

1) has maps of the US, Canada and Europe built-in.
2) connects to an iPod and shows all playlists, song info etc.
3) has bluetooth to connect to my mobile phone for handsfree use.
4) has 15GB of space left on the 20GB hard drive to store mp3s and pictures
5) can easily be moved to another car.

The Saab unit can only do #1 with maps of the US/Canada or Europe I imagine..
 

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I know the answer.

because they dont work!
The nav in my 2007 has never worked. I went to pick it up last night after the 2nd unit was put in.
still doesnt work, so they are going to put in a 3rd unit.
so at 2K we are all paying for all the crappy ones that do not work.
I thought DVD nav were commonplace today.

I would like to ask.
does ANYBODY have a SAAB nav that WORKs.
I put this post out a couple of weeks ago and there was 1 response.
I am getting concerned.
 

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Yes you are correct, the 2007 NAV unit is $2100, but you also have to buy OnStar for $699, so the whole system is $2800!!!!! :roll:
 

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platypus said:
I know the answer.

because they dont work!
The nav in my 2007 has never worked. I went to pick it up last night after the 2nd unit was put in.
still doesnt work, so they are going to put in a 3rd unit.
so at 2K we are all paying for all the crappy ones that do not work.
I thought DVD nav were commonplace today.

I would like to ask.
does ANYBODY have a SAAB nav that WORKs.
I put this post out a couple of weeks ago and there was 1 response.
I am getting concerned.
I spent a while fiddling with a nav system in both an '04 9-5 and an '06 9-3. The 9-3 unit, regardless of what I tried to make it do, which was shut off, kept trying to direct me to Foxwoods Casino. It wouldn't let me disable the directions, change the route, or even turn the thing off.
The 9-5 unit on the other hand, wouldn't direct me anywhere, no matter where I tried to program it to direct me to.

A lot of the aftermarket ones really aren't as great as they're cracked up to be, though.
The guy who towed me after I wrecked my old 9000 had what I think was a Tom Tom, and it kept telling him to "Turn left onto Merit Parkway" even though that entrance has been closed for quite a few years now. It wouldn't even update his route, it just kept telling him to turn around and get on the non-existent on ramp.
 

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My opinion why factory car navigation system is better than portable devices (pls note that I don't have factory navi in my saab and I'm not going to get one :D )-
1) clean look and 100% integration in cars' audio, visual, control, electric systems and console/panel- you can't reach this by aftermarket install. Did somebody ever considered to put some Hi-Fi home stereo on the passenger seat to get better sound than ES1-4 system?
2) it MUST be much more precise than mobile device- I never looked deeply into SAAB factory navigation system but what I can say about my other cars' (Ford Mondeo '97 - I think it has first car navigation system in the world :cheesy: , price- over 4000 Euros :eek: ) navigation- in addition to signals from satellites it receives information from:
-wheel sensor (so it can calculate the speed/distance when there is no satellite reception),
-transmission reverse switch (so it knows when car moves backwards)
-it has its own compass (so it always knows to which direction car is positioned, even when its not moving). All these "add-ins" assist to signal from sattelites to help keep driver on the correct route, especially in bad reception areas or without satellite signals at all. It's not a secret that there are lot's of conditions when GPS can give wrong information.

Of course, big share of troublefree navigation depends on up-to-date maps what is definetely easier to obtain in case of portable devices.
And, I believe car manufacturers put a lots of effort and money to develop navigation technique long time before it appeared in "home use" and of course they want to earn some money from it :) IMO it's absolutely normal.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Why Does Navigation...

I bought a Mio portable navigation at Staples yesterday for a road trip to NH this weekend.
$179
-20 emailed staples coupon
+Tax
-30 rebate

I do not expect it to work as well, or be integrated into my car, but the price was right. And I can using while walking....which is really cool when checking out a new city.

For a factory installed unit, I would be a buyer at the $500 pricepoint. Above that...I just don't see the value as much.
 

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they want £2000 pounds in the UK for the sat nav (and bluetooth) I purchased aGarmin Nuvi 310 with traffic Info and Safety cameras for £299 a year ago and it works great.

The 9-3 i get tomorrow (did i mention that :) :) ) has the sat nav as it was part of the package deal
 
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I noticed on the Saab USA website the navigation option for the 9-5 is $2,945. :eek: However, this includes a 6-disc cd changer in the trunk. But still..
 

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Wulf said:
I noticed on the Saab USA website the navigation option for the 9-5 is $2,945. :eek:
that is cause everyone is paying for mine.
6 days in the shop and they can not figure out why my NAV doesnt work.

brand new car.
undrivable.
 

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platypus said:
that is cause everyone is paying for mine.
6 days in the shop and they can not figure out why my NAV doesnt work.

brand new car.
undrivable.
Tell them to replace it with a new car.
 

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joemama said:
Tell them to replace it with a new car.
I would like to, but there are none left.
this 2007 black aero in parchment w/ every option was tough to come by.
w/ the gm incentives they are going fast.
 

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i',m a little disappointed with mine- the manual is just a few pages - and it does not sem to have the fuctionality of my Garmin.

I also hate not being able to USE POSTCODES - that was so simple, I was unable to find three places I have stored in my garmin - spent about 3/4 hour just entering 5 places i goto (just to ensure i get the traffic info)

also its all in metric - i think i saw a way to fix that here ....

BUT the car is great - love it.......
 
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