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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Saab 2.8 V6 Turbo
Displacement 2,792 cm3.
EEC rating 184kW (250 hp) at 5500 r/min.
Max Torque 350 Nm at 4500 r/min.
Fuel consumption litres/100 km* 15.5/7.4/10.4; auto. 17.2/7.4/11.0.

Audi DOHC all-aluminum 90-degree 3.2 V6 with FSI
Displacement: 3.2 litres (3123 cc)
Horsepower: 255 hp @ 6,500 rpm
Torque: 243 lb-ft @ 3250 rpm
Fuel economy estimates (city/highway)²: Tiptronic: 12.6/8.2 L/100 km/h

Comparing autos, the quattro, despite weighing 24% more than the Saab, gets 36% better mileage in the city and 11% better mileage on the highway. The Saab 2 liter is similarly outclassed by the Audi 2.0 FSI turbo. I realize in the US no one cares about fuel efficiency, but in Europe and Canada, the Audi FSI engines are going to run circles around Saab for petrol power anyway, not to mention CO2 emissions.

I'm just a little stunned at how Saab has fallen so far behind the pack in engine technology, having once been the leader. What happened ?
 

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LinearSLT said:
I realize in the US no one cares about fuel efficiency
Well, not too many did in the past, that is true, but a lot are starting to care, even before Hurricane Katrina. GM was running two-full-page newspaper ads listing all of their cars which were rated at more than 30MPG highway (included the 9-3SS). Toyota dealers can sell all the Prius hybrids they can get (even if hybrid economy isn't all it's said to be.)
 

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I'd say it's a completely unfair statement to say that "in the US no one cares about fuel efficiency". Very many of us do in fact, but you're right that we probably have a higher per capita of wasteful people who drive enormous vehicles that consume enourmous amounts of gas even though no one is in the car/SUV with them. I don't bust on anyone driving an SUV that has a wife and 2 or 3 kids to carry around, or needs an SUV because their job/recreation takes them to places that require 4wd, but I see a woman who works in the building across the street from me who clearly does her daily commute alone in an H2 and I'd really like to ask her WTF but it would be pointless. :roll: I guess the only satisfaction I can take is that gas prices have skyrocketed since I started seeing her driving the Ridiculousmobile.

At any rate I want to wait and see what real world numbers are for the V6 when a lot of folks have them and are driving them.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Yes it's not fair to say that no one cares in the US. There are tons of SUVs with one person in them in Canada too. And gas here is twice your price (but still cheaper than bottled water). So maybe it won't make any difference in either country...yet.

That said, if you go back and look at the infamous Car & Driver article from a week or two ago, you'll see that the 255 hp Audi V6 with 6 speed auto got better mileage on their 400 mile loop than the 250 hp Saab V6 6 sp manual (16 mpg vs 15 mpg). Not as much a deal as one would think but it's for cars that were pushed to the limit on the track and road. Stats at http://img391.imageshack.us/my.php?image=00003resize6px.jpg

Actually all the cars but Volvo beat the Saab in the mixed loop. Andd all had more horsepower. So I think I'll have to stick with my earlier assertion...that the Saab V6 is thirsty.
 

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ok, gas is around $3.00+/gallon here in the US. you mean a gallon of purified drinking water is over $6.00/gallon in canada?
 

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If you buy water by the 600ml bottle, it probably is. But note that the Canadian gallon is bigger than the US gallon by 10%.

As for "wife and 2 or 3 kids", a minivan handles that just fine and is much more fuel-efficient than an SUV.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 · (Edited)
Cojoroh said:
ok, gas is around $3.00+/gallon here in the US. you mean a gallon of purified drinking water is over $6.00/gallon in canada?

Yup. In a hotel in downtown Toronto, you'd pay as much as C$6 for a litre in your room of Evian. At the store, probably around C$2 per litre depending on the brand.But people guzzle it like it was going outa style instead of good 'ol tap water. Check it out http://www.aqua-store.com/Aqua en/order.asp
 

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It looks like 20/29 for the manual and about 19/28 or so for the auto. I have been looking for this infor for a couple of days as I am seriously considering the Sportcombi Aero as a baby hauler (the miata has to go).:cheesy:
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 · (Edited)
Lucky baby ! And safe. In the interests of full disclosure, the A4 Avant is also an IIHS double best pick, though I believe rear air bags are optional, at least here in Canada. Extra 500 bucks. Saab's got 'em standard.

We just built a new house, and with the exception of the foreman, all the trades had older minivans as their haulers. For the same reasons that people find them convenient for hauling kids, soccer gear, hockey bags etc., tradespeople find them pretty handy too. The foreman had a 4x4 extended cab, but in all fairness he had 4 tool boxes in the back with just about enough place left to put something like a wheelbarrow or lawnmower.

So I really don't get this SUV craze. I watched a mother struggle to put her 2-3 year old into a car seat in an Explorer last night at the grocery store. She kept slipping off the running boards (the mother, not the kid !). Really now, wouldn't a minivan have been better ? Much as I loath them, I think there is room in the world for a smart, stylish, high performance minivan. Saab ? Are you listening ?
 

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LinearSLT said:
Lucky baby ! And safe. In the interests of full disclosure, the A4 Avant is also an IIHS double best pick, though I believe rear air bags are optional, at least here in Canada. Extra 500 bucks. Saab's got 'em standard.
I believe you are taking about the rear, seat mounted side airbags... These are optional in the Audi (and most BMW's) because not everyone wants them in their vehicles due to baby seats.

Our Saab does have side curtain airbags in the back, but unfortunately rear seat mounted side airbags are missing...
 

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LinearSLT said:
Saab 2.8 V6 Turbo
Displacement 2,792 cm3.
EEC rating 184kW (250 hp) at 5500 r/min.
Max Torque 350 Nm at 4500 r/min.
Fuel consumption litres/100 km* 15.5/7.4/10.4; auto. 17.2/7.4/11.0.

Audi DOHC all-aluminum 90-degree 3.2 V6 with FSI
Displacement: 3.2 litres (3123 cc)
Horsepower: 255 hp @ 6,500 rpm
Torque: 243 lb-ft @ 3250 rpm
Fuel economy estimates (city/highway)²: Tiptronic: 12.6/8.2 L/100 km/h
Discussion of all economy aside. WOW. Did you notice that the SAAB V6 has more than 100 lb-ft of torque more than the Audi V6, all with almost less than half a liter of displacement.
 

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Rob in Atlanta said:
Discussion of all economy aside. WOW. Did you notice that the SAAB V6 has more than 100 lb-ft of torque more than the Audi V6, all with almost less than half a liter of displacement.
They are 2 different units of measure. The Saab only has 6-8 more pound feet of torque.
 

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LinearSLT said:
Lucky baby ! And safe. In the interests of full disclosure, the A4 Avant is also an IIHS double best pick, though I believe rear air bags are optional, at least here in Canada. Extra 500 bucks. Saab's got 'em standard.
I looked at all of the near lux wagons that are pressently out there and I like the design and style of the Saab, plus since I get employee pricing on all GM and Ford products (My father in law is retired from GM and my sister in law works for Ford) the 2 most economical choices near this size are the Sportcombi and V50 T5. I think both are good, however the Sportcombi has better styling. And for 15% off sticker for a vehicle that will have been out less than a month, how can yo go wrong?
 

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sbl said:
If you buy water by the 600ml bottle, it probably is. But note that the Canadian gallon is bigger than the US gallon by 10%.
hmm...don't think so. Very rarely do we use the "Imperial" gallon over the U.S. measurement of the Gallon.

That aside, I think we tend to use the litre over anything else for that matter.
At this point, I do think that gas is still less expensive in the states now. When I travelled to Michigan, I filled up my car at $3.41U.S./gallon. Before I left the Canadian border, I filled up at $1.41 cdn/litre.

If I convert our measurement to the one in the U.S., we get: $1.20U.S./litre, or $4.50 U.S./gallon.

I sure hope gas prices drop, as I liked the sub- $1 price for a litre of fuel for high-octane not to long ago.

Paul
 

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You can tell how long it has been since I've bought gas in Canada. (Though I'm driving to Sherbrooke, QC in a couple of weeks, so I'll find out then...)
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Actually, the only place I see the imperial gallon used in Canada is in fuel mileage measurements. They are always reported in litres/100 km and mpg, but it's an imperial gallon. When I first moved here I wondered what was in the gas that made Canadian cars go further than American cars. Now I know it's that age old trick, just make the gallon bigger !
 

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LinearSLT said:
I'm just a little stunned at how Saab has fallen so far behind the pack in engine technology, having once been the leader. What happened ?
It's probably fair to say Saab weren't really interested in having to have a V6, I suspect they were forced down this route for the US market.

You are right in your supposions about the European market. The lads in my dealer reckon this V6 will 'bomb' like the previous Saab attempts at introducing a V6.
Especially with rocketing fuel prices and the tax penalties for poor CO2 emissions, they can't see it being a big seller over here.

Maybe the engine efficiency can be improved on as it's developed further..???
 

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I am new to Saab's so maybe I don't understand but I'm confused, based on the article in the link above the fuel economy of the V6 (at least on the US spec cars) is nearly the same for the 4 and for the 6 and is similar to every other vehicle in the class... so why is there the prejudice against a Cadillac power plant? Is there similar prejudice against the current 9.3 because it shares a platform with the Malibu?
 
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