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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
My "old" TXss did get a good treatment, all services done and lately all 6 coils replaced and 6 new Denso Iridium Longlife spark plugs. Last weekend the car developed a problem and went into what I believed was Limp Mode. Now with dealer, the Saab certified mechanic states the one spark plug has "exploded" and ceramic debris from the plug has entered the cylinder and caused (severe?) damage. :x

The car has only approx. 30,000 miles and the spark plugs only about a 200 miles with mild to moderate driving.

The issues:
1. no warranty on the car itself
2. Denso plugs bought from RockAuto US, shipped to Dubai and used here
3. The garage was rather hesitant to put in the non-OEM Denso plugs
4. Has a stage0 Vtune

Now going to the garage to see the damage for myself, pictures will be posted later....

Any hints or tips how to preceed would be appreciated.... :cry:
 

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I would love to see this pics, I would wanna see every little thing they claim..
Exploded plug and all
 

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I feel your pain. This sounds like you got a defective plug. There is no reason why a plug would explode.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Ok, so I just seen the damaged spark plug for cyl#3 (!) and took some pictures. Will upload shortly.

The ground electrode has lost about 4mm of metal, and the white center ceramic insulator lost a piece the size of your little fingernail, only the white part (small).

The saab garage told me they first tried to replace the broken spark plug but the issue is that there is NO compression on cylinder #3. So now a full rear head lift is due, inspection what has broken (likely valve damage) and corresponding repair...

...and these guys are good, incl. the Saab Cert Mech and take time to explain everything and show me the damage.

But, does this suck or what...???
 

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Might be something you can take up with denso, there is no reason why that plug broke
 

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If the ground electrode has any kind of damage, either the plug was too long, the piston hit it, or foreign debris in the cylinder (a piece of piston land or valve) hit it.

Do they have a fiber camera that they can look into the cylinder with? Over here, Harbor Freight has cheap ones for less than $100 USD... Ron
 

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If the ground electrode has any kind of damage, either the plug was too long, the piston hit it, or foreign debris in the cylinder (a piece of piston land or valve) hit it.

Do they have a fiber camera that they can look into the cylinder with? Over here, Harbor Freight has cheap ones for less than $100 USD... Ron

My thoughts exactly....plus, if it was threaded into the head, how did the outside ceramic enter the cylinder? I think it might not have been the cause, but rather caused by the engine failing. What quality/octane gas do they have by you? I know Stage 0 is great, I have and love it, but there have been some cars that have had the tune but experienced too much knock under full throttle.....I would contact Brian and bring him up to date as well in case he has any thoughts to add.




Sean
 

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If the ground electrode has any kind of damage, either the plug was too long, the piston hit it, or foreign debris in the cylinder (a piece of piston land or valve) hit it.

Do they have a fiber camera that they can look into the cylinder with? Over here, Harbor Freight has cheap ones for less than $100 USD... Ron
They have to pull the head so you will find out, but I too think that a broken piston might be the cause. If the plug is too long, wouldn't all six of them get hit?
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 · (Edited)
Picture....

They have to pull the head so you will find out, but I too think that a broken piston might be the cause. If the plug is too long, wouldn't all six of them get hit?
Exactly! Head will be pulled, but really don't want to pay for this.

The very plug used is (still) recommended on RockAuto. All 6 cylinders have the same sparkplug and the car has run well for a few months, while few miles driven:

Iridium (higher melting point & strength than platinum for maximum durability)
DENSO Part # 3421 {#SK20HR11} Iridium Long Life
Engine Code B284R; Turbo X
OE Recommended Iridium Long Life - Patented Iridium Alloy Plug (90% Ir) With Platinum Ground Strap; Engine Code B284; Aero Model
Part Image
$6.17



Sorry for the rather poor pic quality, taken in the garage with iPhone4 (stone age?)
 

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Damn...sorry to hear and see that Sandy.

And I'm not familiar with that plug. The IK22? is the plug Vtuner recommends and the one I've been running for about 25,000 miles.

Murphy's Law is really attacking you:(
 

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Exactly! Head will be pulled, but really don't want to pay for this.

The very plug used is (still) recommended on RockAuto. All 6 cylinders have the same sparkplug and the car has run well for a few months, while few miles driven:

Iridium (higher melting point & strength than platinum for maximum durability)
DENSO Part # 3421 {#SK20HR11} Iridium Long Life
Engine Code B284R; Turbo X
OE Recommended Iridium Long Life - Patented Iridium Alloy Plug (90% Ir) With Platinum Ground Strap; Engine Code B284; Aero Model
Part Image
$6.17



Sorry for the rather poor pic quality, taken in the garage with iPhone4 (stone age?)
Detonation maybe. Do you use 93+ octane gas in it? maybe your stage tune isnt as good as you thought.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
No warranties....

Brian recommends another Denso, "IKH22 5345, we have never seen a problem like this. The IKH22 is a colder heat range than stock so it is less prone to knock/detonation"...
 

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Thats detonation. Guaranteed to ruin your day. You need to periodically monitor how the tune is running, no matter who's you have. That way you can catch a problem before it happens.
 

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Exactly! Head will be pulled, but really don't want to pay for this.

The very plug used is (still) recommended on RockAuto. All 6 cylinders have the same sparkplug and the car has run well for a few months, while few miles driven:

Iridium (higher melting point & strength than platinum for maximum durability)
DENSO Part # 3421 {#SK20HR11} Iridium Long Life
Engine Code B284R; Turbo X
OE Recommended Iridium Long Life - Patented Iridium Alloy Plug (90% Ir) With Platinum Ground Strap; Engine Code B284; Aero Model
Part Image
$6.17



Sorry for the rather poor pic quality, taken in the garage with iPhone4 (stone age?)
That damage is from pre-detonation, the piston did not hit the plug, if it did the center electrode would've been smushed way before the white insulator got cracked. Maybe that plug wasn't gapped correctly, and that cylinder misfired. Or a prob with that cylinders coil.
 

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A miss or coil issue is no ignition at all. Could you take a pic of one of the other plugs? Knock is typically associated with cylinder temperature and pressure being higher than the fuel's autoignition point... Was it really hot the day it happened? Did the pump make a switcharoo with the fuel quality? This should not happen, the car will pull as much timing, boost, and add as much fuel as it could to make the car not go boom...
 

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A miss or coil issue is no ignition at all. Could you take a pic of one of the other plugs? Knock is typically associated with cylinder temperature and pressure being higher than the fuel's autoignition point... Was it really hot the day it happened? Did the pump make a switcharoo with the fuel quality? This should not happen, the car will pull as much timing, boost, and add as much fuel as it could to make the car not go boom...
Titan, u r 3 funny. Of course it was hot the op lives in Dubai. Lol. But uu could have a good point with the ole pump switcharoo. Do uu think it's possible that the plug itself was defective from the factory?
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
So I understand knocking and detonation are symptoms of premature auto-ignition. However, should not the Engine Control Unit and the corresponding control logics inhibit any severe issues, like detonation?
The fuel used is always the highest available here, 98 octane. And yes, the climate is hot, but not much more so than ie Arizona or New Mexico. Still, Brian states he has never seen so hot intake temps, 140-160F.
The engine is being taken down and out and the rear cylinder head removed for assessment.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Oh, and all the other 5 plugs look like new, nothing on them at all.
Everything looks like new and seeing all this new stuff, plugs and coils on top of the engine, knowing there is this internal damage, hurts...
 
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