[pb]

Why is there no Saab turbo diesel models in the USA? We have VW and Mercedes sportin' a TDI model in the states. In fact, I used to drive a VW Jetta TDI and loved getting 40+ mpg. But I love the Saab convertible too much to go back. Too bad VW did not have a TDI convertible. Is there such a thing as a TDI (or is it TID) convertible Saab in Europe? Does it compare to the VW or Mercedes TDIs? Seems to me it would sell here in the states (especially now with the price of gas)... better gas mileage + the Saab look all wrapped up in one.

Anyone know if Saab plans to sell a turbo diesel in the states or it GM has any big plans for the Saab (diesel or hybrid models)? Just curious.

 

[DougR]

My guess would be this.

To VW, I cannot imagine that TDI models represent more than 10% of their sales, and I imagine it is more like 5% or less. Now VW sells a ton of jetta's and golf's, they are everywhere.

By comparison SAAB has a much much smaller market than VW, so given 5-10% of their market share being TDI, it would not be worth selling here.

 

[Jeremy R.]

In a couple of years (2007, I think) no diesel engine will be able to meet the US's new emissions standards, so chances are we will never see a Saab diesel, and the rest of them will be leaving the market pretty quickly. The cost of diesel gas in the past couple of years has gone up to the point where it's more expensive than most types of unleaded, so the fuel economy savings isn't as great as you might think it is.

 

[DougR]

I noticed that as well that diesel seems to be as expensive as premium, and when gas was cheaper it seemed it was often more expensive.

 

[pb]

Hmmmm... yes, diesel is now as expensive as a premium gas; however, the mpg is much better (a few years ago, diesel was cheaper than regular grade 87 gas). In my auto Jetta TDI, I got low 40mpg and my friend who has a manual Jetta TDI + a micro-chip upgrade (to boost HP) gets close to 50mpg. Additionally, I never had to take the TDI for the annual "emmissions testing" as it was not required. When I called VW about the E.T., they stated the TDI burned cleaner and more efficiently than a regular gas engine and did not have to pass the std ET. Heck, I don't know if this is true or not... but I believed him. Maybe Saab just did not go the extra mile to get their TID certified in the USA like VW and Mercedes have.

Any input from the European members? How does the TID Saab compare in terms of mpg, emmissions, and of course... overall performance.

 

[philosophicaldreamer]

In a couple of years (2007, I think) no diesel engine will be able to meet the US's new emissions standards, so chances are we will never see a Saab diesel, and the rest of them will be leaving the market pretty quickly. The cost of diesel gas in the past couple of years has gone up to the point where it's more expensive than most types of unleaded, so the fuel economy savings isn't as great as you might think it is.

I thought that I read somewhere that by 2007, the American market will have access to much more refined diesel fuel so that European diesel cars can be brought to the States. In Europe the diesel powered cars get as good mileage as hybrids do, and diesels are not only much more reliable bult also cheaper, too.

Ta-ta, janusz

 

[Jeremy R.]

We will have access to better diesel fuel, but it will mostly be for trucks and busses. The US has decided to concentrate on particulate emissions for their standards instead of CO2, like the Europeans use. Even the best diesels running on the cleanest European diesel fuel still put out too much particulate matter for our new standards.

 

[Marquis de Saab]

Any input from the European members? How does the TID Saab compare in terms of mpg, emmissions, and of course... overall performance.

That smaller 2.2 lacks power and appears to be a bit noisy and unrefined. It's a same GM diesel built into 2000- Opel/Vauxhall Vectra and it showed to be reliable and economical. CO2 is lower than any other gasoline engine offered by Saab.
About that other new 3.0 V6... I was looking at some 9-5's with that engine thinking of it as my potential next car, and while browsing mobile.de I found great number of them with very strange bugs showing on rather low mileage. Apparently lot of them had engine rebuilt at 80-90k miles, some of them replaced under warranty even earlier, there were few on sale with "motor lauf", meaning blown. Why, how?? How can someone destroy big diesel engine which delivers so much power and torque on such low rpm? How can you blow that engine before, let's say 200k? Saab released it early 2002 and I think there are things to be done there, but potentialy it's a good diesel and Europe will be grateful for it.
BTW, in this part of Europe you simply don't see gasoline VW. Maybe every 50th VW is not running on diesel, even then it's more likely to be LPG than a gasoline.

 

[pb]

Thanks all for the opinons and replies on this topic. I thought for sure Earthworm would have a say on this subject... EW? anything?

 

[V6man54deg]

there's another New diesel engine in the Opel /Vauxhall models now that replaces the 2.2 TID or dti - its the Fiat derived CDTI (common rail diesel) 1.9 8 valve 120 BHP and 1.9 16v 150 BHP - just towed a caravan to France with the later in a Vectra - excellent on fuel loads of Torque and the 150 has a 6 speed gearbox, I'm sure these are now fitted to the new Saab 93 (in Europe)

Thanks all for the opinons and replies on this topic. I thought for sure Earthworm would have a say on this subject... EW? anything?

 

[Marquis de Saab]

Funny, two hours ago I was talking to a guy in front of my home who bought last week new 93SS with stronger 150hp 1,9 diesel. Man, it doesn't even sound like tractor diesel and pulls like hell!!

 

[earthworm]

Thanks all for the opinions and replies on this topic. I thought for sure Earthworm would have a say on this subject... EW? anything?

My thinking is much more European than American.

The trouble is, our so-called benefactor ,GM, kicked the Diesel in the mouth with their POS Cadmobile V8 Diesel with the cheap injection pump and fragile engine..GM has gone thru some rough times, bought on by their arrogance and stupidity.. They may or may not recover....
So, everyone else in the world, but Ford and GM have automotive Diesels - I believe our government is protecting our last two auto-makers by going along with unreasonable pollution standards...And causing high Diesel fuel prices - The oil that is used is simpler, easier to refine, should cost less than "regular", and did at one time...
But, in reality, our government is shafting its own people - not the first time either....

BTW, I admit to being leery of a Fiat Diesel...
I am the one who averaged 50 mpg for 100K in the slow Golf....
VW has nearly 30 years experience with the Diesel, and they learned from Mercedes with 70 plus years....

But it is more than the durability, the torque, the 40 to 60 mpg, it is the fact that vegetable oil can be used as a fuel !!!
We can "grow our own" and end up telling the Islamics to pound sand !!
But, in this area, our government has done nothing !