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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I know this has been discussed here in the past, but I have had no luck finding the original threads...

What are the appropriate plugs to use on an Aero?

I ask, because when I was getting my 60k mile service done the tech charged me extra for platinum plugs because "they are needed for the Aero"....

The car doesnt seem to drive as well any more under heavy load, and I seem to remember people here saying they had trouble with platinum plugs and favored copper ones...

Any ideas?

If he did - in fact - put the wrong plugs in I am going back and insisting he replace them.

Thanks for your help,
Matt
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 · (Edited)
Chris 9-5 said:
Hmm after having read that I just have more questions :p

Let me explain my symptoms though, and see if any of you recognize them

Occasionally, (usually only when its warm out) under hard acceleration in second or third, once I reach high in the RPM range, (4500+ rpm) the engine will momentarily lose power. it comes right back after a second or so, but is quite disconcerting as it is accompanied by a crackling or sparkling sound from the engine bay...

Its difficult to troubleshoot as I can not reproduce it on demand. It just happens on occasion.

My teories were as follows:
-Spark plugs (platinum instead of copper?)
-Leaky vacuum hoses
-Blowoff valve problems (I'm about to replace this one)
-Sensor issues (O2 sensors, MAF sensor, crank sensor?)
-Throttle body needs cleaning?
-Fuel Injector cleaning?

Unfortunately I don't know enough about the above to say anything with certainty.

As mentioned I am about to replace my blowoff valve with a forge variety, and I have looked through what I think are my vacuum hoses, and I think they look good, but I am not sure, casue I don't know exactly what I am looking for.

Any Ideas?

Thanks,
Matt
 

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Matt what do u have done to your car?
what gas do u use?
that crackling sparking sound could be detonation which is really bad.. check your spark plug gap... and the spark plugs should be ngk bpr7es-11 thats what most tuners suggest.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
ricot83 said:
Matt what do u have done to your car?
what gas do u use?
that crackling sparking sound could be detonation which is really bad.. check your spark plug gap... and the spark plugs should be ngk bpr7es-11 thats what most tuners suggest.
UGH. That definitely sounds bad. Not driving the car until I can get it checked out is not an option, as I have to get to work, but I am going to drive it "nicely" and not rev it much until next Friday when I can have it checked out...
 

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I think some of your problem is related to the BSR upgrade you have. It doesn't seem to do so well in the summer heat. XAAM had a lot of problems with power being reduced as well, you might wanna talk to him.

Back to the issue of spark plugs, the platinum plugs are technically required, but I see no real reason to use them. I'm planning to change them out for 7ES copper ones just cause the platinum ones are waaaaaaay too expensive. Just make sure you keep whatever plug you used gapped properly, at least every oil change.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Raven18940 said:
I think some of your problem is related to the BSR upgrade you have. It doesn't seem to do so well in the summer heat. XAAM had a lot of problems with power being reduced as well, you might wanna talk to him.
Any turbocharged car is going to have less power when it is warm out becasue of the way the intercooler works, but this sort of sudden drop with bad noise is not expected...

Its worth mentioning that this never happened prior to my 60k mile service - even in the summer heat last year -, and after it it has happend 3 or 4 times under hard acceleration. The BSR update has not changed since then...
 
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Matt I have run plat plugs since I have had my car without any problems and I am running with the same power that you have. I replaced for the copper BCPR7ES-11 for a recent 1500 mile trip to France (Very high temps.) I can feel no noticible difference accept that my wallet is much fatter with the cash that I saved. I also used to get momentary high rev power loss but I didnt get any crackling noise and it turned out to be the DI just starting to fail. :confused:
 

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I have read several threads where power upgrades have tipped DI's over the edge into failure, can you try another DI? :confused:
 

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Mattlach said:
I know this has been discussed here in the past, but I have had no luck finding the original threads...

What are the appropriate plugs to use on an Aero?

I ask, because when I was getting my 60k mile service done the tech charged me extra for platinum plugs because "they are needed for the Aero"....

The car doesnt seem to drive as well any more under heavy load, and I seem to remember people here saying they had trouble with platinum plugs and favored copper ones...

Any ideas?

If he did - in fact - put the wrong plugs in I am going back and insisting he replace them.

Thanks for your help,
Matt
The plugs in my aero are NGK PFR6H-10 and i am going to replace hem this week as first step in solving my turbo power problem
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
The word on high from BSR tech support:

Datum postat: 2005-07-17 16:20
Namn: Mats Karlsson
E-post: [email protected]
Status: besvarad av BSR

Ditt medelande: 2005-07-17 02:04
Hej,

Jag har trimmat min 2001 SAAB 9-5 Aero till er "steg 2" specifikation.

På mitt SAAB forum (www.saabcentral.com/forums) har det varit mycket diskuterande om vilken typ av tändstift man bör använda på en BSR trimmad bil.

Har ni några rekommendationer vad gäller tändstift? Jag hittade inget om detta i er FAQ.

Tack på förhand,
Mats

BSR: 2005-07-17 16:20
Hej Mats Karlsson,

BSR: Vi rekomenderar original tändstift NGK BCPR6es-11. Vid mycket hård körning (läs bankörning eller autobahn körning) så kan man använda NGK BCPR7es-11.
Saab motorer är mycket känsliga vad gäller tändstift varför det är MYCKET viktigt att inte använda något annat än original tändstift.

Med vänliga hälsningar /BSR
Translation for you non-swedish folks :p

BSR: We recommend the OE sparkplugs NGK BCPR6es-11. For hard driving (track racing or Autobahn) you can also use NGK BCPR7es-11.

SAAB engines are very sensitive to what spark plugs you use, and thus it is VERY important to not use anything but original spark plugs.
 

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I believe that Maptun and Speedparts recommend the same ;)
 

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Thats interesting mattlach because the dealer i last visited said i should use nothing but the NGK PFR6H-10

I notice that finn, chris etc use these bcp 7s.

I wonder which plug is most suitable or in fact if all 3 are equally suitable ?

If changing plug type, then do you require to disconnect battery or anything strange like this ?
 

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Thedriver said:
If changing plug type, then do you require to disconnect battery or anything strange like this ?
No, you disconnect the DI to remove it anyway, so their is no power at the plug, do it when the engine is cold too.

I have used the 7's for ages now right from 150 bhp to current spec, the only time I had a problem is when I tried the 8's ;)
 

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Sounds like you are getting Knocking.

I have Maptun Stage 3 on my 95 aero and found I had a similar problem.

Maptun recommended that BCPR7ES-11 are used with their Stage 3. I have changed to these and now I dont have a problem.

I would ask BSR which plugs they recommend although I think it is safe to say that BCPR7ES-11 will work better than what the dealer recommends.

regards
Chris
 

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mushdaffer said:
I would ask BSR which plugs they recommend although I think it is safe to say that BCPR7ES-11 will work better than what the dealer recommends.

regards
Chris
"BSR: We recommend the OE sparkplugs NGK BCPR6es-11. For hard driving (track racing or Autobahn) you can also use NGK BCPR7es-11.

SAAB engines are very sensitive to what spark plugs you use, and thus it is VERY important to not use anything but original spark plugs."

So we'll all use NGK BCPR7ES-11's then ;)
 

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Well thats as clear as mud then!!!! It looks to me that yo use bcpr7es or similar on standard cars and the platinum jobbies on the aero? Why in the firstplace did saab put platinum plugs on the aero as original equipment.They must have tested everything they could and they must have worked closely with NGK to make sure they got it right. Inview of problems with DI ,s etc I would be tempted to stay with what the book says.Therefore mine stays with the platinum plugs. As I have 2 sets sat in my cupboard that will last at least 25k so I know I dont have an option.
 

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Chris 9-5 said:
No, you disconnect the DI to remove it anyway, so their is no power at the plug, do it when the engine is cold too.

I have used the 7's for ages now right from 150 bhp to current spec, the only time I had a problem is when I tried the 8's ;)

Chris, my anticipations were more to do with the trionic mappings in that if the spark plugs were so crucial to engine performance etc becuase of their resistances, then all the trionic maps are based on a particular set of plugs. If you then change the plugs and therefore the resistances, then what effect does this have on the trionics ability to optimise engine efficiency if its current plug resistances are now different to what all its previous feedback reference maps were on the previous plugs ?

And heres another query :). im still a little puzzled about whether to use the 6s or 7s, i find it strange that they recommend the 6s for all 9-5s, because i thought the aero even in standard form would differ from a base model 9-5 ?

I really want to be sure that if i change plug type, it does not hurt my beautifula motor in any which way at all.
 

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Thedriver said:
Chris, my anticipations were more to do with the trionic mappings in that if the spark plugs were so crucial to engine performance etc becuase of their resistances, then all the trionic maps are based on a particular set of plugs. If you then change the plugs and therefore the resistances, then what effect does this have on the trionics ability to optimise engine efficiency if its current plug resistances are now different to what all its previous feedback reference maps were on the previous plugs ?

And heres another query :). im still a little puzzled about whether to use the 6s or 7s, i find it strange that they recommend the 6s for all 9-5s, because i thought the aero even in standard form would differ from a base model 9-5 ?

I really want to be sure that if i change plug type, it does not hurt my beautifula motor in any which way at all.
Trionic is constantly adjusting, as the plugs wear and the gaps increase etc etc, plus about a million other things it takes into account, so it will be very prompt in adjusting to the new plug, I wouldnt disconnect the battery as all useful data will be lost and all will need to be re learnt.

The 6 is hotter than the 7 and the 7 hotter than the 8 the idea being that the higher the tune the cooler the plug, so the 7 is spot in the middle and hence all the major tuners (abbott and saab aside) recommend it.

As for saab knowing that plats are best, they also believe that 18,000 mile oil changes are ok and the PCV system was designed correctly in the first place.:roll:

If you have any doubts please use the one you are happy with, if thats the plats then fine ;)
 
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Chris 9-5 said:
The 6 is hotter than the 7 and the 7 hotter than the 8 the idea being that the higher the tune the cooler the plug, so the 7 is spot in the middle and hence all the major tuners (abbott and saab aside) recommend it.
Interestingly when this subject has arisen in the past I had a debate with Abbotts about plugs. They use the plats as standard in all thier tuned cars mine included. When I questioned this Pete the tuner man from Abbotts sent me an e-mail saying that the BCPR7ES-11 were completely fine but have a shorter life than the plats, but as I change them with the oil every 6K then I should use them and save some money.. :)
 
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