SaabCentral Forums banner

1 - 20 of 22 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
274 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
On both my 2001 9-3 and my 2003 9-3 when you start them once in awhile you'll get a rough idle where the cars fighting to get up to speed. On the 2001 93 SE the car is been restored. The motor was taken out all the seals were done , new timing chain, the head was tank'd, and all new valve seals and had gasket. The car has a brand new OEM ignition cassette. NGK laser Platinum. I've had the throttle body off and it's spotless. All the rubber hoses in the car have been replaced with new ones. I know the throttle position sensor can start to go bad and not throw codes I've seen it happen before. I've got an aftermarket throttle body sitting around that's like brand-new I pulled off a car that junkyard I was thinking about switching out just to see if anything changes. It doesn't happen all that often just once in a blue on the 2001. However on the 2003 it happens almost every time you start the car. I've already done ignition coil spark plugs on that car as well throttle body is spotless. It was having a rough time starting and I took out couple of the grounds the one on the transmission the one that's under the window washing reservoir on the body of the car and clean them and put them back in and they seem to help the starting of the car I feel like there's still a few grounds I need to locate and clean on that vehicle. But something is telling me that this problem on the start is not because of a bad throttle body or a bad TPS. Both cars have the original idle air control valve and they're both clean. Both cars are throwing no codes. Obviously it's got to be in air fuel mixture problem on the start. I'm guessing since it's getting fuel and all the injectors are fine I've already done a noid test on both vehicles it's got to be air. Does anyone know why this would be happening. I'm not too familiar with the idle air control but I've been thinking maybe it's got something to do with this considering I think it's the air going to the throttle body that's in question. Is there a way to check the idle air control. The positive crankcase ventilation on both vehicles has been redone from top to bottom. I'm really just kind of stumped if anybody is dealt with this before found a way to overcome it I'd love to know. I'm also pulling apart my first ABS module I have a couple bad ones laying around. I cracked the case on the first one getting it apart I'm guessing you have to maybe bake them in the oven to loosen up the glue. Has anyone ever taken one apart and resolder the connections. I know from experience that when you send them out and have them redone they usually don't last that long maybe about a year before they start going kaput on you. however it's getting harder to find parts at the junkyard they're not coming in like they used to so maybe it's time to figure out how to fix these things by myself. Thanks a lot fellas I'm just about to put a stage 1 tune on the 2001. just want to make sure everything's okay before I do that. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
274 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
See if it's the fuel pump.Ok both have new fuel filters.I was just looking at wis and saw the fuel pressure regulator.was wondering if that could be the culprit .maybe gunned up or shot.? Thanks Bob.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
973 Posts
Grounds - see post 12 in this thread:-


I need educating - I thought the original 9-3 throttle bodies with IAC and TPS were only up to model year 2000. From 2001 to 2003, both functions are done by the new TB and ECU. Does your throttle body have part number ending in '186 on the black cover?

Doug
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
274 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
you could be right when I read a code on these cars it always comes back to the throttle position sensor which I thought was the black piece in the back I pictured . if it's not the throttle position sensor I don't understand why the car tells you that in the code . unless I'm wrong unless I'm remembering something wrong. I would love for you to explain because I don't understand. What is the function of the black box in the rear if it's not the throttle position sensor. And why when that sensor goes bad does the car go into limp mode. Thanks so much for the info always learn something unfortunately that's a joke I just wish the car would stop breaking sometimes it's a week-to-week thing for five years. I don't ever get 14 straight days driving without something going wrong. It's hard to believe there's anything left to fix.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
274 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
Doug thanks so much for pointing me in the direction of that thread about grounds that's exactly what I was looking for to find the rest of them. I'm about to change the O-rings on the oil cooler lines going down to the oil filter housing. Another member told me that there was something to do with the oil lines that got clogged I want to say it was on the right side of the engine where the harmonic balancer is somewhere down there they told me to look out for something that will get clogged and needs to be cleaned it's not the oil pressure switch I can't remember what it was you guys have any idea. At the time I was swapping out Transmissions meaning to cuz the first one was no good and I never got a chance to go for it I'm dying to take a look cuz after these O-rings the rest of the system has been restored including the oil pressure switch.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11 Posts
This happens to me as well on my 99 viggen but on a warm start. New fuel pump , maf , vacuum lines are good , no codes, new dic , plugs

Sent from my SM-N970U using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
274 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
Thanks for chiming in Nick.Not glad to hear it's happening to you but I knew I couldn't be the only one. It has me stumped but I'm going to figure this one out.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
274 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
Here is one were u raise idle speed via tech 2.none of these seem to hit my problem on the head but still maybe part of the fix.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
274 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
I switched idle air control valve from a 2001 to the 2003 .the 2003 is a lot worse. I want to see if it helps but when I was doing that I found one of the hoses on the 2001 that goes to the vacuum on the motor was old and ratty . I guess I never changed it . it looks like it's falling apart ..so that might be my problem right there . I'm going to switch it out and see what happens.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
274 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
I changed the idle air control valve didn't seem to change very much honestly the car seems a little bit better it wasn't as rough starting as many times as usual but it's hard to tell. I'm going to try to take out the vacuum fitting make sure that fitting is clean I'm going to take the throttle body out and clean the valve where the idle air control goes through I'm going to do a test with a vacuum pump on the idle air control to make sure it's working properly as best I can. When I took apart the valve cover the positive crankcase ventilation ports or tubes were completely solidly clogged. I had to get a torch and heat them in order to get the material out of them so I wouldn't be surprised to find that there's other things that are clogged. I was looking over those crowns and there's one ground that's on the number 4 cylinder. the pictures a little tough to decipher having a little hard time finding if anybody can give me any clues that appreciate it. Thank you fellas
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
973 Posts
Both have a tps in the rear .
The rectangular box is the release solenoid for limp home mode, allowing manual control of the throttle plate by the gas pedal. The large black cover protects the electromagnet which drives the throttle plate, commanded by the ECU. Neither is a TPS, the function of which is performed by the ECU and the two potentiometers in the TB.

Interesting to see that TB with the markings erased but still showing "Hella".

Could you post a pic of the IAC you changed? According to the Saab parts catalogue the IACs were used with the earlier type TB, up to 2000, not the type of TB in your pics.

Doug
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
274 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
now in the 2003 SE Bob recommended that if it doesn't start or is tough to start I turn the key on let the fuel pump Prime for 30 seconds and then start it and I did do that and it works fine. So my question is what does that tell me does it tell me that my fuel pump is getting weak . The car has a new fuel filter. Or is there something else I should be looking at as far as the fix for this. The car is in great shape otherwise. This car was a real project I probably put about 120 hours into it in the last nine months ABS module had to be done how do you say new plugs ignition coil I had to change the water pump and the water pump housing was ruined from the teeth of the old pump. It's got new axle seals. I took down the oil pan and resealed it it's got a new passenger axle. Got a new map sensor. The throttle body has been changed I took out the turbo and rebuilt it. New brakes front and rear. Was able to find a good side unit to throw in her. Those are getting hard to come across perfect ones. New serpentine belt. New alternator. Got a new valve cover gasket even though they don't call it a valve cover. How to draw some broken studs on the exhaust manifold. I'm sure there's more stuff that I'm just not thinking of right now but that's the core of it. Here's a picture of where this idle air control unit sits if that's what it is. I mean I know it's controlling the vacuum going to the throttle body.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
973 Posts
This one didn't show up for sone realm on the first try.

Thats referred to as "Vacuum Valve" in the parts list, REACTS TO -ve or +ve pressure in the TB and inlet manifold, and controls the bypass valve (H in the diagram below), which diverts turbocharger output back to the intake side when the throttle plate closes and the turbo is still at high rpm.

( https://www.thesaabsite.com/catalog/saab-9-3-9400/?year=2000&bs=CV&engine[]=B205L&engine[]=B205R

diagram shows the two TB types, older at the top with its separate TPS part no. 15. Your TB has part 25a, the limp solenoid. No separate TPS or IAC.


shows the old type TB, TPS and IAC arrangement, just for interest, since it doesn't apply to yours).

Here's the connections to the bulkhead vac valve:-

Screen Shot 2020-05-24 at 10.31.29.png


I wonder if your valve H is goosed? Should be able to poke your finger in and move the diaphragm against the spring, and if you then hold a finger over the vac port, it should hold the vac.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
274 Posts
Discussion Starter #20
I'll check it out and thanks alot for the info .I love to learn stuff like this.Makes for a more accurate diagnosis and repair.
I have the wis but don't get alot of time to look through it. although I love it.the I valve on my 2001 is about 3 yeare old 14000 but the way they make these parts now who knows .I will check it out .looks like d is the vac fitting still want to pull it make sure it's clean. I'll tell you one thing if you pull that hose off the end of that age files to computer throws a code instantly. I have a serious love you're not going to beat me relationship with his car. My 2001 was very abused. the first thing I had to do when I got it at 90,000 was pull the motor and put a new timing chain in it at that point I did about everything I could to the motor short of replacing the Pistons because they look to be in good shape. The car as it sits right now is pretty much restored new suspension new interior. Just about every part that could be changed including the transmission twice has been updated or changed on this car and that's why this idle issue is really bothering me because there's really not much to look at in the car that's not new or in new condition. But thank you so much I can't wait to run through some of this info very impressive.
 
1 - 20 of 22 Posts
Top