[renizer]

Hi there guys,

got an offer for some parts off an aero, since i need charge air piping, swaybars and some other small odds and ends (not necessarily off an aero tho).
anyways so i was wondering if there would be any fitment issues since i have an early 9-5 (MY98 but produced in 97).

does anyone know some details for the charge air piping to be more specific? i'm talking about the pipe from IC to TB.
thesaabsite and other resources suggest there are like 3 different setups, 98, 99/00 and 01-up..
my setup is a rubber duct from the IC, then a solid metal pipe (guessing 2" diameter) to the TB which is connected with a 90* rubber elbow.. since both hoses are shot and the metal pipe is a bit disgusting (visually), i might just change the whole setup..

swaybars - it's an aero station wagon. are there any difference from a station to a sedan? asked to get the end links and bushings so i can mount them as-is, but i'm prepared to buy new bushings for appropriate diameters and new endlinks if need be. another issues i might run into with this? are they worth messing with it? my 9-5 has excessive roll and is one of the things i really dislike about it.

turbo & cobra pipe: this has probably been discussed in all details on here.. i'm getting the hoses as well so i was expecting this to be a simple replacement with the TD04 turbo.. is that right? also is there a whole lot of difference in turbo response with the TD04 vs. the GT17? i really like the low boost threshold tbh.
and for the cobra pipe: which MY has the different PCV connection and are there any other differences along the years (Aero). since i'd buy the turbo as well i was guessing no probs for mating it to the compressor housing at least..

any thoughts on all this?
thanks for any input or links or whatever!

Andi

 

[renizer]

ttt, somebody needs to have some insight on this..? plz share

 

[renizer]

okay guys i'll try this once again..

does anyone know the specs of swaybars over the different years of our cars please?

also for the charge air pipes, if anyone has an idea about the differences and parts interchangeability, also over the years, please let me know!

i really need some input here guys, any help is appreciated!
thanks
Andi

 

[MikeFitz]

Hi Andi,
Not sure what your question about the charge air pipe is. If you feel your one is shoot, there is a nice upgrade part from abbott. On the TD04 and Cobra, I've replaced my GT17 with the TD04, the difference is night and day. The garrett was good low down with no lag but the TD04 is in an another world, a bit of lag but not to an extent that would be a problem. I've also replaced the original cobra with a cobra from a '99 aero, I wasn't expecting much but this did improve performance. I've got a stage 1 from JZW and love it, you will need to get a tune to take advantage of the TD04. No idea about the sway bar though.

Mike.

 

[renizer]

Hey Mike,

thanks for your reply and feedback!
For now I've decided to keep the GT17 because I love the short spoolup time and nice torque range, and it doesn't feel like there's a whole lot restriction on the topend either..
Would you happen to have a pic of your engine bay where one can see the charge air piping (from IC to TB)? It seems to me that the early cars are different here and I'm trying to find out which parts interchange here, with the later Model Year cars.
Also any more info on that Abbott kit would be nice, although I'd guess that be a more cost-intensive approach and as such is ruled out for my application (that's why I'd prefer used parts, and need to find out which parts are a direct fit).

P.S. I just received some T7 tuning equipment where I'm gonna get in there myself, but for now power seems nice enough with the smaller turbo. And I'm more annoyed by the floaty suspension anways, so need to fix that first Planning on Aero swaybars and one of those cheap Vectra B coilover sets..

 

[MikeFitz]

Hi Andi,
to be honest there isn't much to see in the engine bay. I still have the original alloy charge pipe, mines a '98, they came as stock. The abbott racing one is

http://www.abbottracing.net/product.php?id_product=259

Looks good but I couldn't justify it.

Prior to getting more power, I got the saab road holding kit, that has the aero sway bars, it's not so floaty anymore. I know some here have done the coil overs, personally I'll be going for the bilstein and eibach set-up in the new year.

 

[renizer]

Mike, the alloy charge pipe, exactly. That's what I got and from my research it seems only the MY98 had that. MY99/00 and then MY01-up having a different setup again.
Since MY98 isn't that plentiful and I don't care about keeping stuff original, I'd like to swap to a newer setup since all of the charge air path parts (IC outlet hose, alloy pipe, TB hose elbow) have seen better day and look like they'd be leaking soon or already.
... But I'm not sure if I can just swap in parts directly from a newer year.

On the Abbott link: the whole kit is close to being as much as I paid for the car so that's definitely not in my budget That's some good information tho.. It's 64mm and it states: "All alloy construction for all 9-5 range 1998-2010MY" ... seems like I could just swap out the whole charge piping for a later year then Thanks!
On the increased diameter: I'd guess the stock piping is like 50 or 55mm.. Unless power is about Aero-level or higher imho there is not much to be had really. I will admit the whole kit looks nice tho but just too spendy.

On the suspension.. Road holding kit, I've read that a few times but haven't really found a source to get it from (ok, haven't searched that much either) . Aero sway bars are on my list, but it seems the '02-'04 (or 2002-up) Aero had beefier ones according to GS here... Then again it's only one millimeter anyways ^^ What else does the Road holding include?
Thanks again for your input.

 

[imola_red]

I believe the roadholding kit came with Aero struts, springs, and sway bars.

I'd imagine it'd be a really pain in the @$$ with shipping, but if you were to splurge on the suspension, I'd recommend SAS sway bars. I recently had them installed and now my wagon stays stupid flat in corners to the point that I feel it has no right to corner the way it does. Their site also has some good info about stock sway bar sizing: http://www.sasab.com/saab-9-5/9-5-front-and-rear-sway-bar-kit

Oh and if you're dropping the front subframe to replace the front sway bar, replace the subframe bushings while down there with '06+ units (should fit... I think) or poly. Helps tighten things up front and improves shifter precision a bit.

 

[renizer]

Right, i was looking at the roadholding kit some more yesterday.
I have also looked at the SAS sway bars, but they are just too expensive for me now, accounting for shipping and customs. Gonna be around a total of 400€ and this is just not worth it for me at this point. I'm thinking with Aero swaybars and Vectra coilovers I should be eliminating most of this annoying roll. The SAS kit IS a whole lot beefier, sure.
Thanks for the input. Also good call on the subframe bushings, I haven't thought about these.. Anything else I can replace while I'm in there? ^^

 

[Jssaab]

INcreased charge pipe inceases lag times a bit, think about it you need to ove more air there to fill the extra pipe colume. I wnet to a 2.5 aluminum pipe and the increase i lag was noticable Also it gets hot as balls under the hood, I don;t think it adds ot heat soak tho, bt could

If you get faster charmging to max PSI you are good, Once you have hihger than atmosphere PSI you are moveing enough air usually ( for a stock or even a bit better Turbo)

 

[imola_red]

Anything else I can replace while I'm in there? ^^

I asked my local indie Saab mechanic the same thing and he didn't recommend anything else.

 

[renizer]

so coming back to this, i of course won't go to the abbott intake charge piping due to that one being too big in size and cost for me ^^

tried to figure out charge air piping. below is the setup or a similar one as i have (1998/early style with the metal pipe), part 12 and associated ones. then 99-up right next to it is 12A (P/N 4753828), and it seems 2001-up has a variation of that (5191770) but should be pretty similar.

anyways, i think i can just swap the whole setup from the MY00 aero donor car to get my leaky old setup replaced, and also the newer one is more pleasing to the eye imho and won't heatsoak as bad if that should be an issue.

meanwhile i also got an offer from a local vendor (slovenia) to offer me up the 20mm rear swaybar from Ultra Racing. Cost roughly 220 euros shipped.. Not sure what i want to do, it's not exactly cheap for just the rear bar. does come with the bushings, just for the record, but no end-links.

i bought the ECU, lock motor and LH inside door/window weatherstriping/rubber guide thing from the MY00 Aero for 115 shipped which i don't find all that bad.

next on my mind is the cobra pipe... i'm so confused with this part lol, so many different versions. this is making my head spin :roll:

so far my attempt after two hours worth of compiling a list in chronological order: please comment and correct as needed!

9173378
MY98-00 all LPT (early Aero?)

9192568, 30584297
MY00-03 Aero (230, 250hp) and MY01-03 LPT
Note: P/N 9192568 is no longer available - replaced with 30584297.

5959218 (=55559826?)
04-up all LPT & Aero, "but from 2006 the Aero got the King Cobra pipe matching the modified turbo" - restrictive from 250~260hp upwards (DrBoost).
Note: P/N 5959218 superseded by 55559826?
edit: seems the 5959218 P/N is also used for the earlier Aero pipes... this one is claimed from 2000 actually, not sure what to think

55559826
04-05 all LPT & Aero (250hp), then 06 - 09 only LPT

55560602
06-up Aero only, "King Cobra" pipe 260hp - 15 mm shorter compressor housing needed; only works on TD04 i take it?

the last three ones (04-up) all need pcv breather pipe modifications (which?);
except for the king cobra pipe i would assume all pipes work with the GT17 LPT turbos as well?
what's the gains between the different styles, anyone?

guessing the 250~260hp 55559826 pipe would be the best gains for least amount of work - can use standard GT17, but have to adapt pcv pipe?

thanks!!

one more on the cobras - this is what epc has to say on the matter, FWIW!

 

[renizer]

bump on the cobra pipe.. i take it any cobra pipe is an upgrade to the very early style one? how much is the difference of the late model non-king to king-cobra style? or the early Aero pipe?
please i need some input on this thanks

 

[ChattySaaby]

When I was doing research for my 03 9-5 Aero, I was only aware that there's a non-King Cobra and a King Cobra pipe, so if there were different versions of the non-King Cobra I can't comment about that. The best upgrade is the King Cobra but you need to have the proper turbo housing or have your turbo housing modified to use it. I didn't want to modify my turbo so I went with the GS cobra pipe. I will also say that I considered upgrading this part a lower priority.

Regarding one of your earlier posts, I believe the King Cobra came from the factory mated to a TD04 turbo. If an earlier year TD04 turbo can be machined to accept the King Cobra (a service that GS provided), I don't see why you couldn't do the same modification to a Garrett turbo to accept the King Cobra. However, if one were to go through this trouble, I think it would make sense to with a TD04.

 

[renizer]

thanks for your input ChattySaaby. I think I only ran into the earlier versions of the cobra pipe, as opposed to the 04-up "non-king" and king cobra version only, because I have a very early model of these cars to start with. so i might also have bigger gains with switching it out for a the later (bigger) version.

for your 03, did you also have to modify your pcv tube, and if yes how did you end up doing that?
what results did the bigger cobra pipe bring to you? i take it the GS pipe is then a king cobra size pipe but for the pre-06 cars (LPT and Aero)?

yeah seems you need to shorten off 15 mm of the pre-06's longer compressor inlet, or change the compressor housing to the later style, in order to make it accept a 06-up OEM king cobra pipe. i guess i agree with you on modifying the GT17 to that tho..

on another account.... has anyone just deleted the cobra pipe and used two 90° silicone bends and intercooler piping with the fittings added?

 

[ChattySaaby]

I suggest you compare your cobra pipe with a non-King Cobra pipe from a later year like mine and see if there are any significant differences. I still have my stock pipe so I can send you a pic if needed.

The GS cobra pipe is a direct replacement, no modification needed except that you need a 1" hose to connect the cobra pipe to the turbo bypass valve. You can order it with a silicone hose from GS for that purpose.

 

[renizer]

i was of the impression that all of these inlet pipes were referred to as "cobra pipes", regardless of year, because of their general shape. maybe you were talking about king cobra and non-king cobra tho, discard that comment then. i'm sure there are difference other than those that are easy to spot on the first look so not sure if a visual inspection of pics is worthwhile although this one suggests there is substantial difference: http://www.saab-tuners.com/images/stories/turbo/saab_intake_kingcobra.png
ah yeah i remember looking at the GS pipe a while back and seeing the needed hose for the bypass valve. so pcv breather pipe is stock, do you have the red grommet one or the threaded pipe deal? i thought that was 04-up with the re-re-redone (read: hopefully most sophisticated yet) PCV system.

i guess in that pic i posted it's the (early style??) cobra pipe to the left, than king cobra OEM pipe and on the right a SS aftermarket piece, probably the mentioned GS pipe since it has a shorted bottom neck for the pre-06 longer compressor housing inlet?

 

[ChattySaaby]

Sorry, I was talking about non-king cobra pipe; I've edited my post for clarity. My factory pipe looks like the one of the left, and I upgraded to the pipe on the right.

Regarding the breather pipe, are you talking about the attachment pointing upward from the top bend of the cobra pipe? If so, I think mine was a threaded pipe.

 

[renizer]

chattysaaby, yes i was refering to that attachment on the top bend. it's the pre-turbo pcv discharge tube. if i'm not mistaken, 04-up has this red plastic grommet and a plastic line, whereas the early ones have a threaded pipe end here. anyone has input on how to connect the two different styles?

 

[TankTak]

chattysaaby, yes i was refering to that attachment on the top bend. it's the pre-turbo pcv discharge tube. if i'm not mistaken, 04-up has this red plastic grommet and a plastic line, whereas the early ones have a threaded pipe end here. anyone has input on how to connect the two different styles?

When I went from the threaded type to the king cobra I just cut a portion off each end and connected them using some rubber fuel line