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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Finally found some free time to get on the rollers today. :cheesy:

I originally dyno'ed the car, at the time completely stock, minus the cat and this was the result. 154hp 182tq at the wheels



After that run, I had a local Saab buddy, WPressly flash the ecu with a de-tuned Viggen map. After a day at the track, that led to a blown GT17.

So I performed a 15T td04 swap, open intake, and had Mr. Pressly work his magic again on the ECU, and hit the dyno today to see what she was making.


EDIT: Graph not posting correctly, will fix and re-post... New numbers are 200hp and 210tq at 10psi at the wheels with an AFR graph that started at 15.47 and did a squirly downward spiral to 11.5


Quite a difference. Not 100% happy with it though. The graph doesn't show, but it was only running 10psi. Will says the tune was set for 18psi..but I was seeing knock. I need to talk to him to confirm this statement, but she was lean, which led to knock, which led to a low boost/misfire map. And look at that AFR! :( Really need to pull that down to the low 12s-11 afr at WOT.

Also, I think the solenoid that the WG/Turbo/Intake hooks up to may be going bad. Before the first run, it started clicking real loud, never heard that before. It stopped, and I thought nothing of it. First pull, it slowly climbed up to 10psi, but at 5200rpm, boost and power dropped like a rock, just fell on it's face. Second pull, you can see in the graph, boost held and power looked to be holding as well up top. Like to find some high rev springs, and run it out a bit more, as long as it's continuing to make power up top.

What's got some ppl around the shop asking questions, is running 1.4 more psi, and having a +28tq and +46hp gain. Granted the turbo, intake, and tune has changed...its just 1.4 more psi, wouldn't think it would make that big of a difference. Just imagine what the numbers would be if I actually made a run at 18psi. :cool:

So I guess from here is to fix the knock/mis-fire problems. I'm thinking 1 stage colder plugs, a new cassette, and tighten up the gap on the plugs. Also thinking a complete fuel system clean needs to be done...more importantly making sure the injectors are cleaned thoroughly, and flowing properly. Any suggestions?

Just to confirm:
1999 Saab 9-5 SE 2.3T
140k miles
5 speed
mods: no cat otherwise stock exhaust, 15T turbo, open intake, TurboSmart BOV, WPressly's tune,
 

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Assuming approx 15% drive train losses you would have got a bigger increase from a stock Aero ECU and the TD-04 wouldn't you?
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Honestly don't know Chris. I probably would've had Will tweek the stock Aero tune anyways.

Are there any other graphs with before and after like mine to compare?
 

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I probably would've had Will tweek the stock Aero tune anyways.
Why?

His first one blew your turbo and the second one shows less than a stock (SAFE) Aero tune..........
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I have pulled and clean the pan back in Nov. when I did the clutch.

I don't know that the fuel filter has ever been changed, but it's going on the "to do" list with the rest of the fuel system.

I would tweek stock Aero tune, because it's not exactly stock. Catless exhaust and an intake, so I would probably flash like a stage 1 aero tune, or something along those lines. That is why.

Today's #'s sucked because I was getting knock. From my vague understanding, when these ECU see knock, they go into a mis-fire/low boost map, rather than push the full 18psi it was tuned for, it was only kicking out 10psi. I'm probably not the best at explaining that situation, but I know Will, or someone with more experience on tuning these maps could explain it better.

I'm not most knowledgeable guy when it comes to these cars, but I'm familiar with tuning mitsu's. And I don't know if these ECU's are the same, but I know on a mitsu if the ECU see's knock, it will immediately start to pull timing, which can severly effect your vehicles output. If these are the same way, and pulls timing, that would be another reason the numbers are not the greatest.

I guess what I'm saying is even if I had a stock Aero ecu, and it was acting up the same way, with the knock problem, I don't know that the output would have been any better or not?
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 · (Edited)
The first turbo blew because it was bone stock for 137k of it's life, then I turned up the boost and beat on it all day at the track. It was on it's way out my friend.

I'm pretty sure I read here, or saablink that gt17s don't take a lot of abuse before they give up anyhow. I was expecting for it to go so I can do the td04 swap. No sweat off my back.
 

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I guess what I'm saying is even if I had a stock Aero ecu, and it was acting up the same way, with the knock problem, I don't know that the output would have been any better or not?
Yep fair point.
 

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Wait a sec, i thought you were down power, but i've just noticed that thats 201whp, is that not aroyund 230bhp, which is standard aero power for your year model?
 

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You made a good bit more power, it does not look bad at all. Remember boost is not power;) You can get a lot more power by advancing the timing and the fueling and then the td04 pushes a lot more air than the gt17 at the same boost pressure and there are a lot of other differences.

You are not correct in your thinking of how t7 works with boost, there is no second boost map, it just allows less and less airmass as the ecu detects knock. It will add fuel, pull out timing and then pull out airmass to keep the motor safe.

The a/f will richen up if knock is detected, so the a/f is not far off in my opinion.

Gaining 46whp is around 53bhp and that is not too shabby for what you have done,

John
 

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Your 9-5 and your numbers...

230hp claimed for an aero i believe... 230*.85=195.xx hp at the wheels...
200hp sounds ok...

Di could be dying... I have been having a heat issue killing my tune and having my car run out of steam... maybe just throw some new plugs at it (bcpr-7es11's of course) You definitely need to redo the rest of the vacuum lines... best $10 you can put into your car...

tdo4 will flow a bit more air than gt17 so I can see where that 1.4psi makes more difference....

Where are you getting your PSI numbers from J?

Yes, like i txt'd u j you really need to throw a gauge on your rail to see what psi you are seeing at the injectors under boost...

process shoud be techron with a new tank of gas.... beat on it 5 pulls... change plugs then fuel filter then oil....then go again...

you need to compare mAir and mReq so see what she is doing...

Also what are your AIT's (tAir)

A dying stock fuel pump at 140k miles.... stranger things have happened to we saabers

hit me up I need to come buy and throw my car on the dyno once I do the bosch 044 inline
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
The dyno computer was hooked up via a vacuum T on the BOV line. That's how I know it was pushing 10psi. I shoud've got the boost line printed on the graph..

I agree with the vacuum lines, there are some nasty rotten ones in there, that will be addressed very soon. Same with the DI being done soon.

The a/f looks whack to me. Most of the big hp cars we tune the a/f gets down to 12.5-11.x and stays flat across the board.

AIT is usually anywhere from 30-42 usually whenever I check it. Varies....
 
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