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Discussion Starter #1
So I've been smugly watching saggy headliner threads come and go as mine, up until this week, has been tigher than a witch's handbag.

Until last week.

All at once it's given up the ghost and sagging all over the place! :eek:

Question to those who have pulled it out: what is it made of and is it possible to paint it? Or must it be recovered with fabric? From the other threads and from the hole in the fabric of our liner it seems to be some kind of molded fiberglass. Can't tell if it's spongy or if that's just a layer of upholstery foam . . .

Thanks in advance,

aleks!!!
 

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my understading is: if you pull it all out the car will be very noisy. get it recovered, my car came with a new headliner and it looks so awsome! the glue between the firebreglass and the fabric breaks down with heat and moisture over time, it really too bad!
 

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My first C900 did not suffer this problem and I wondered what people were talking about ... until my second C900 :roll: I put up with that for the duration of my ownership and must confess, too, to feeling a little smug about buying a pre-100,000 miler with an intact headliner.

... but, yes, very recently (within the last month), it has come adrift.

I don't see why it can't be painted. I think it would be very difficult to seperate the remainder of the headliner from the backing without making a scrappy mess of it. Actually, I suppose a wallpaper steamer might do a good job of removing the cloth. If you can get the saggy bit removed to an edge, you might well be able to do a decent "pull tight and re-stick" job and not have to investigate how to remove the rest of the cloth.

From experience of trying re-sticking procedures in-situ, my opinion is that these things are must easier to deal with when the liner is out of the car. I hear they are brittle and a gentle removal with the help of a friend is the best way to go. I'm sure once you have it out, you'll see whether a re-stick or a remove and paint (or recover) is the way to go ...

If you get to doing the job before I do mine (which, being a terrible slacker will probably be next year :roll: ), let's see some pictures or the process and results.
 

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The "biscuit", as the headliner shell is called, is some kind of fiberboard. The headliner detaches because there's a layer of foam rubber between the headliner fabric and the biscuit, and this foam crumbles to dust with age:x

Recovering the biscuit is definitely DIY-able; search this Forum for instructions--there is even a link on here somewhere to an illustrated DIY guide:)

The hardest part of the job is getting the biscuit out of the car in non-hatchback 900s, but hints for this are also somewhere on this Forum.

Finally, consider having a pro do this job; it's only about $200 (including removal and installation). Might be worth asking around...
 

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As above:) $200 is the usual price at a Car Upholstrey shop.
DIY costs are approx $60.. Fabric and Spray glue.. takes an entire day tho.
Cardboard Shell comes out the trunk on a 4dr with out too much dificulty. 2 people helps.
Sure looks/feels better with a new liner though.
 

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A 900 without headliner isn't too noisy. I drove my T16 around without one for months!

The headliner shell seems to be made from compressed fibreglass. The old fabric can be removed by carefully pulling it off. It'll leave the foam backing behind - get rid of this with a stiff nail brush, or a super-soft wire brush (like a nubuck-suede brush).

With care and patience, it's quite possible to refurb the headliner so that it's as good as new. Better, in fact, because modern adhesives will last longer.

Rumour has it that Saab used water-based adhesive for the headliner, which is why years of moisture build-up in the roof space causes the fabric to sag.

It's important to note here that the shell is very fragile. If it bends, then it'l break and repair is difficult.

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If you have a 3 door with no sunroof I have a perfect headliner that is in a car getting wrecked in a week or so. You can just swap them out for the cost of your effort.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Thanks for the replies, guys. I didn't reckon that it'd be that hard a gig, just wanted to get some opinions BEFORE ripping the thing to pieces.

I guess I'll pull the thing next weekend and begin a refurb. One of my clients is an upholsterer so I may be able swing some help/supplies/advice!!

Jetman, thanks for the offer but I've got a 3door with sunroof (liner sagging there as well!) . . . Any luck with the 82 SPG that you were looking at?

Is there anything else that should be addressed while I've got the liner out?

cheers,

aleks!
 

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The head linning is the simplest job ever on a Saab and i drove around for a year with it sagging, only to discover how easy peezzy it was to remove and re trim.

The foam under the clother was like crumbly powder and i sanded it all off, then i had to reinforce the wooden board as it was soggy, so a day ontop of my electric heater got the water out, then i applied PVA glue, lots and lots of layers, use it neat, no mixing down with water, i did this on both sides to make it nice and strong and quiet, after i that i used lots of spray glue be very generous but not so much that the cloth gets soaked and the glue shows through.

Start from one end and slowly work back applying lots of firm pressure on the board and new cloth and soon you will hav one amazing looking head linning.

This is what i did in a gret sued and its lovely, only cost £18 for the fabric and £3 in glue.

I fogot to do the sun roof;oops: , well am taking the HL out again soon to change the tail gate to its going to get done then:D

I wish i had taken pictures.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Thanks!

So ShadoWorks you're saying; REMEMBER TO DO THE SUNROOF AT THE SAME TIME! Gotcha. :D

Good luck with the chariot, Jetman!!

I'll try and remember to take some pictures along the way, too. Mind, the pix in the link from ProfZ are really good so it may be redundant . . .



aleks.
 

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hi shadoworks would be great to see some photos of your suede head linning also where did you get the fabric and what colours are available thanks
 

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Sued has such a nice feel to it, one chap did his whole dash board!

It is also dampens road noise and when it rains i can hear the rain tapping on the roof, the PVA glue has alot to do with that also.

You can get Sued in Grey, Brown, Black, Slate, Maroon, Cream, White, Peach, Rustic Red, Tea Green and almost any colour you want, it depends on your local stores, small shops like sewing and textile factories have miles of these fabrics, you really are the cat amoungst the pigeons.

fabric like this cost round £8 per yard, i only neede 2 yards for my head linning.

How do the guys lod up the big pictures on here? the ones i load up can only be 640 by 460 ?
 

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Hey shadowworks, i used lots of PVA glue on my headliner too. Glad to see its not just me doing it!.

I started using it neat, but decided to water it down pretty soon (as it doesnt go very far neat!). Worked fine that way but took a lot longer to dry out (Mine spent a week in the garage with an electric fan heater next to it each night!)

640x480 should be plenty for a picture! (especially one just being used to describe a job). I hate big ones that break the tables (unless theyre fancy 'glamour shots' ;) ). I still read the forums at 800x600 at work sometimes.
 

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I have webspace i dont know how to use yet:eek: i will learn.

PVA is really strong, my boss told me to take as much as i liked or needed as we have massive drums of all types of glues at my work, all very strong and Toxic!

I think i used about 3 litres! it really does not go far neat but its tuff and has a natural flexibility which other glues types of glues dont have like araldite which i could have used but its a binary glue and has to be mixed and its difficult to do in quantity.

To be honest i think i did dry my head linning for a few days;oops: it was soft and soggy, so i new the PVA would trap the dampness if I didnt fully dry it out.eally

PVA gets into the fibres and makes it strong from within, thats another reason why i choose PVA.

I will try and up load a thread for replacing the head linning if there isnt one already. Its one of those things people think is a nightmare when its not and is a great feeling to DIY and have a nice job at the end.:cheesy:
 

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I linked above to the one indexed in the SC Tech.Help section.;)
 

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If you want a softer feel....

The only thing I'd add is that if you like a soft feel to your headlining, don't just glue your fabric to the headliner. Spend just a couple of dollars and buy some soft foam (about 3mm or so thickness), and glue it to the headliner, trimming it back from the edges of the headliner by about 5mm or so. If you have a sunroof, trim the foam back about 15mm from the edges of the sunroof hole to allow for the pinchweld rubber to go back on readily.

Don't be too fussy about how well you glue it on..you're just wanting it to basically stick.

Once the foam is attached, use a spray adhesive to glue the fabric to the foam, allowing at least 30mm overlap of extra fabric all around the edges of the headliner.

Once all is dry, flip the headliner over and using a contact adhesive applied to both the edges of the headliner and the folded over edges of the fabric, stick the fabric to the headliner. (By contact adhesive I mean the yellow, strong smelling stuff where you apply it to both surfaces initially, then seperate them, and then stick together 10 mins later when the glue is all super tacky).

IMHO, the extra couple of dollars and extra 15 min work with glue and a Stanley knife are well worth the more "luxurious" feel and appearance. If anyone wants to see pics of the finished result I'll be happy to post one or two.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Thanks for the foam tip - I'll be removing the headliner once I'm done my coffee (still morning here!) and will strip and dry it out today. Hopefully tomorrow . . . or next week . . . . . I'll reupholster it and reinstall it!


cheers,

aleks.
 
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