[horsehockey]

 

[Nocturne]

That's scary. Now days you just don't know what's cloned and what's authentic anymore.

 

[cleeland]

Yet another reason to use the copper plugs and just replace more frequently.

 

[ksw92_mk2]

I learned the hard way not to buy plugs on Amazon. One time I got 3 new and 1 used plug from them. Another time I got counterfeits. Now I just shop the local parts chains. The price differences aren't that great anymore. Amazon is getting to be too much like eBay only with fewer buyer protections...

 

[bob3000]

Now I just shop the local parts chains.

My best ally ever is an independent small parts shop (three man operation, the delivery guy is a saint), twenty years of non chain and non web bliss.

Now I wonder if the Carnation Instant Breakfasts I get monthly from Amazon are real....
.

 

[BobSaabit]

My best ally ever is an independent small parts shop (three man operation, the delivery guy is a saint), twenty years of non chain and non web bliss.

Now I wonder if the Carnation Instant Breakfasts I get monthly from Amazon are real....
.

II used to have an independent just like that near me. Three guys who were there for a couple decades at least and always knew what you were talking about. Could get most common items (still went on-line for Saab particular stuff). I could walk there in a pinch. The owner (not a guy who was ever in the store) sold out to Car Quest. A year later, Advance opened a store in the next town over. A year after that Advance bought Car Quest... and then a few months later shut down the Car Quest store.

Carnation Instant Breakfast? They still make that? I used to drink that back in the 80's.

Back on topic: I bought an emblem off Ebay that was supposed to be genuine. Genuine part # in listing. Phony - part #'s on the back that were never Saab numbers.

 

[toxicavenger]

I had this issue a while back with light bulbs. Now I only buy them from my local shop.

 

[andybisnut]

Ack. I've been buying copper NGK plugs from Amazon for a while now. My car has seemed OK but this is good to be aware of.

 

[andybisnut]

Another clue is the slightly odd English. I work in the tech industry and see hundreds of SPAM emails a week. We always get a chuckle at the slightly odd English of non-native English speaking scammers. (A recent one was from someone claiming to "Have some gift for our staffs.")

In this case, the giveaway for me was "Good Brand Name NGK" in the Amazon description. I don't think NGK would ever say that, lol.

 

[Jeremy R.]

There's a reason stores that price match Amazon require that the item be sold and shipped by Amazon, and not just fulfilled by them. It seems like the chances of getting a fake product go up exponentially when the item is sold by someone else. Amazon doesn't seem to care what people send them to store in their warehouses.

 

[andybisnut]

I could have fake plugs in my car for all I know. I have purchased "NGK" BCPR7ES plugs from Amazon the last 2-3 spark plug changes. I'll get them locally or from one of the European parts sites from now on.

 

[9-5r]

Makes me really wish the techline was still open so I could call and speak with an engineer to learn why they said to use ONLY the laser platinum BCPR7ES-11 and the PFH6R-10 for the Aero's and 04-05 arcs.
Personally I'd never use anything but those plugs. I tried the iridium's and the engine performance drop was very noticeable.

Not worth the risk of losing the DIC to me. A few years ago they weren't too bad but at $15 a plug its ridiculous.

 

[Nocturne]

Makes me really wish the techline was still open so I could call and speak with an engineer to learn why they said to use ONLY the laser platinum BCPR7ES-11 and the PFH6R-10 for the Aero's and 04-05 arcs.
Personally I'd never use anything but those plugs. I tried the iridium's and the engine performance drop was very noticeable.

Not worth the risk of losing the DIC to me. A few years ago they weren't too bad but at $15 a plug its ridiculous.

Higher temperatures, more air volume from the turbo, different engine tuning, different timing, spark advance etc, plus maintaining longevity, reliability and driveability are the reasons I would think as to why they state to use only those plugs.

 

[9-5r]

Well.. it's been said NGK assisted in the development and engineering of the ignition casettes.. in what capacity exactly we'll never know. As long as its a resistor plug, itll run. For how long is anyone's guess.

With that said the tech line allowed us a connection directly with the engineers who work on and develop whatever system one needed assistance with. Albeit with an hour wait minimum usually.. so it was really a last ditch effort left for the truly truly devious issues. The last thing you want is to waste an hour or more on hold you wont be getting paid for.. that's GM for you.

Your right in the standard choices manufacturers use for spark pug choices. But to limit the customer to one or two plugs, I'd love to hear the exact reasons why even if it's beyond my understanding.

 

[bob3000]

I'd love to hear the exact reasons...

Perhaps not the "exact reason" but the recommended plugs act as critical knock sensors.
.

 

[9-5r]

Ohhh yes, that's right. I totally forgot about that. That's why they need to be resistor plugs.. i wonder if at the time these were produced NGK were thr only manufacturer that made reliable, quality resistor plugs. Maybe it was a licensing thing.
Regardless, I'm shocked people would spend the time to make knock-off spark plugs. The process and machinery required cant be cheap. They can't be making a lot of money.. then again you never know. Whats the world coming to when you have to worry about knock off spark plugs. It's unbelievable.

 

[Jeremy R.]

I remember my dad telling me years and years ago, probably in the '80s, that resistor spark plugs were almost always used in cars because they didn't interfere with radio reception. It's not like they're a new technology. I always thought it was odd that Saab specified NGK spark plugs. Bosch would seem to be a more likely partner, since they made the non-turbo ignition system and countless other parts in the car. I'd be curious to know, if anyone knows, how NGK came to be the spark plug supplier.

 

[qwikredline]

GM powertrain worked particularly long and hard with ngk on the ecotec and saab engine platform ...

 

[9-5r]

It wasn't necessarily just the reception (as far as I know, things were a bit different then and thats before my time), but its also the frequency that most ignition systems operate on from what I remember. If you have ever driven a car where there's an electro static type of hum (noise is hard to describe) that gets more pronounced on greater application of the throttle- resitor plugs should cure it. It's an interesting thing. I don't know the science behind it all, but electronic frequencies can get complicated. Some people cant even hear that hz. range. Things were much different in the 80's compared to today.