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Discussion Starter #1
Over the last couple weeks I've replaced control arms, strut inserts, and tie rod ends as well as gotten new (used) front tires along with an alignment from Big O.

Here's a timeline:

Phase 1: Before replacing any hardware or tires - pulls to the right a bit
Phase 2: After replacing control arms and strut inserts and tie rod ends - pulls a bit harder to the right
Phase 3: New tires put on - pulls really hard left
Phase 4.1: Get alignment done - still pulls hard left
Phase 4.2: Swap front tires - pulls to the right a decent amount
Phase 5: Get front right tire replaced because Big O said it had a "natural pull to it" - still pulls to the right, only marginally less.

Here's the measurements after alignment:

Front left camber: -1.2* (in spec)
Front left toe: 0.12* (in spec)
Front right camber: -0.7* (in spec)
Front right toe: 0.11* (in spec)
Rear left camber: -2.3* (out of spec by 0.3*)
Rear left toe: -0.23* (out of spec by 0.12*)
Rear right camber: -1.8* (in spec)
Rear right toe: -0.16* (out of spec by 0.05*)

So I've still got a pretty decent pull to the right as well as a constant vibration that seems to travel through the car in clearly defined waves above 65-70 mph.

Any idea what I should be looking at next to remedy this situation? My logic tells me that the alignment computers are correct, therefore the pull could only be attributed to a faulty tire. But then again, I'm not completely sure what affect the rear has on steering and vibrations. Any input is greatly appreciated.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
If the pull changed sides when just swapping the tire (and wheel) then that's probably your culprit. Personally I'd start with 4 matched new good brand tires mounted and balanced on a RF machine (after you have verified the wheels are round and true), double check the tire pressures too.
Ahhhh money :confused:
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Would a bad axle be a possible cause for the vibrations above 65? There is a hell of a lot of grease build up on the subframe right near the driver side inner CV boot and I didn't do a lot of inspecting at the time to see if it's good or not.

I do recall reading somewhere that bad CV joints/axles can cause high speed vibrations.
 

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Wow!..
Ive been fighting rear vbrations and a tad up front for quite sometime..Ive rebuilt the entire car o utside of the tranny, motor, and steering rack. Most of the time the culprit(s) are tires or wheels and or balance. Not in my case.Make sure you have your "good" tires Hunter roadforce balanced; for starters., as others have suggested."Most" folks will tell you alignment will not cause vibrations, and i sort of agree. If you had some "radical " numbers then i would say yes, it could be alignment... My rear axle had some alignment numbers that were similiar to yours, out of spec, but not horrible. YOu will get some poor tire wear with your alignment numbers. I just did a rear axle swap and was lucky, the toe specs came out nice on this one..... For the camber, i installed Nicks (GS) larger of the 2 shims before i even went to the alignment shop.There again, i guessed correctly, and the camber #'s were just a bit over - 1, which is what we like.(around -1) I did not feel considerable gains in ride quality..Some quick and easy things to check for starters are: Front and rear wheel bearings, sticky or partially frozen calipers(all 4 corners), parking brake shoes not adjusted correctly.Another thing you should check would be the rear shocks and condition of the upper shock mounts at body..Are you getting any shimmy/vibes in the steering wheel? Did you make sure all your wheels(mounting surface) and wheel hubs on car are super clean and flat before you torqued your wheel bolts down? Good lluck and keep us posted

Also, check your CV boot asap!

Edit, Just saw Jakes comment:That is highly suggested as well. Are you new "used" tires evenly worn and have abunch of tread left?
 

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i would look at bad tires ( OP installed new I think?) or camber shake.Camber shake can be brutal. The alignment specs quoted are bewildering to me. My .02c
 

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Would a bad axle be a possible cause for the vibrations above 65? There is a hell of a lot of grease build up on the subframe right near the driver side inner CV boot and I didn't do a lot of inspecting at the time to see if it's good or not.

I do recall reading somewhere that bad CV joints/axles can cause high speed vibrations.
Bad axles usually cause issues under accelearation and load, like up a hill on the highway. They generally go away when coasting down hill.

I'd try to find a Hunter Roadforce machine with the StraightTrak option. They can tell you a lot about what your tires are doing to the car. http://www.gsp9700.com/search/FindLocations.cfm
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Wow!..Some quick and easy things to check for starters are: Front and rear wheel bearings, sticky or partially frozen calipers(all 4 corners), parking brake shoes not adjusted correctly.Another thing you should check would be the rear shocks and condition of the upper shock mounts at body..Are you getting any shimmy/vibes in the steering wheel? Did you make sure all your wheels(mounting surface) and wheel hubs on car are super clean and flat before you torqued your wheel bolts down? Good lluck and keep us posted

Also, check your CV boot asap!

Edit, Just saw Jakes comment:That is highly suggested as well. Are you new "used" tires evenly worn and have abunch of tread left?
Just replaced rear shocks about a month ago, mounts looked just fine.
Haven't looked at wheel bearings yet. I suppose it wouldn't hurt to pull those and repack with grease.
Calipers haven't been touched either, aside from removing the front for suspension component replacement and clutch job. I wouldn't imagine those would produce a shake only above 65.
No shimmying in the steering wheel. Just the consistent vibration along with the rest of the car and then, of course, the pull to the right.

i would look at bad tires ( OP installed new I think?) or camber shake.Camber shake can be brutal. The alignment specs quoted are bewildering to me. My .02c
The tires I had installed up front are "used" but with plenty of tread and, at least eyeballing it, even wear.

I am thinking the fact it only has the vibration at 65 and over, though very consistent, should cut down on the possibilities. I'm leaning towards the axle/CV-joint as I had a buddy with a 97 Prelude that exhibited very similar symptoms that disappeared when the axle was replaced.

Sucks I'm working on an extremely tight budget though. Buying a new axle only to find out it's not the problem leaves me with a shaky and potentially dangerous car for at least another two weeks.
 

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Have you checked the tire pressures also, one low tire will cause a pull and if you swap that tire side to side the pull will also change like you describe.
Unless you a friend with a known good set of wheels and tires you can try for free you are gonna have to spend some money to fix the problem, be it getting the tires correctly balanced on a RF machine or throwing some new parts at it.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
You might want to ask yourself why the previous owner of the tires discarded a matching set of 4 with plenty of tread.
Haha I have asked myself this question many times when buying tires from this local place. The answer I convince myself of is people with newish cars deciding they want to look cool and upgrading their tire/wheel combo, discarding lightly used tires in favor of some sweet low-pro rubber (or whatever fits on gold wire wheels, in this area). I'm probably deluding myself though. :roll: Get what you pay for rings true.

Have you checked the tire pressures also, one low tire will cause a pull and if you swap that tire side to side the pull will also change like you describe.
Unless you a friend with a known good set of wheels and tires you can try for free you are gonna have to spend some money to fix the problem, be it getting the tires correctly balanced on a RF machine or throwing some new parts at it.
I actually haven't checked the tire pressure recently. Gonna do that this afternoon.
I understand it's going to cost money, and I'm not opposed to that. I'd just rather have the most likely things at the top, hence this thread. The collective is surely smarter than I.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Also, I'm less worried about the pull right now than I am the high speed shake. From what I'm reading it's sounding more and more like they're probably two separate problems.
 

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Perhaps, but maybe not. A buggered tire will cause all kinds of issues.

Regardless, you've identified at least one problem. The tire (or wheel) is messed up. Fix that, then chase the vibration.
 

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As others have said, you need to get your wheels balanced. I am surprised Big-O didn't suggest this first off. This should have happened when you got the new tires, as it is standard-operating procedure. Start with the front pair and see if that turns up anything. If those are balanced, then do the rear pair.

Can you feel the vibration through the steering wheel?

I one had a high-speed vibration similar to what you are reporting. I found out after a few weeks that the tire shop down the corner, who tightened lugs with an impact wrench, did not properly tighten one of the front wheel lugs. It was almost completely loosened from the rim. I am lucky I did not lose it on the freeway. Do not ever allow them to use an impact wrench to tighten the lugs back on.

I find myself surprised at how generally incompetent tire shops are when it comes to resolving this sort of issue. Usually the shop-owner knows his business, but with the employees it is very hit and miss.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Re-igniting this thread to take the conversation off the So what did you do to your NG900/OG9-3 today? thread.

RECAP:
I had a pretty gnarly shake in my '99 and thought maybe it was worn front components and bad tires. I replaced control arms, strut inserts, and tie rod ends as well as got new wheels with 80% tread left on the tires.

The front now feels smooth(er) but there's a nasty shake that really seems to originate from the rear when I get up to 65mph+. It really feels like a side to side motion but I can't say for certain there's no up-down motion.

Possibly related is at low speed (1-15ish) on a smooth road, I feel a slight up and down motion as I'm driving. Like driving over small seems in the road, but only from the back (I think).

I haven't yet taken the current wheels to a roadforce machine, HOWEVER I had this same feeling with the previous wheel/tire combo.

As mentioned at the beginning of this thread, I know the rear toe is out of spec (toe in) as well as the camber (negative). I've yet to try shimming it.

So, besides the obvious "take it to a roadforce machine", what else should I be looking at to exorcise the shakeghost?
 

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Discussion Starter #17
As others have said, you need to get your wheels balanced. I am surprised Big-O didn't suggest this first off. This should have happened when you got the new tires, as it is standard-operating procedure. Start with the front pair and see if that turns up anything. If those are balanced, then do the rear pair.

Can you feel the vibration through the steering wheel?
After the new wheels (mentioned in previous post to this one), the front feels much better and there's minimal vibration in the steering wheel. All seems to come from the back now.
 

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After the new wheels (mentioned in previous post to this one), the front feels much better and there's minimal vibration in the steering wheel. All seems to come from the back now.
Start by jacking the car. Rig a pointer so that you can rotate the wheel and look for an out of round or side to side motion in the wheel or tire. Bends temd to be on the inside edge where there's no support.
 
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