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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Between '95 and 2003 I had a slew of 9000s and I drove them everywhere. I'm a c900 guy at heart, but the ability of 9000s to gobble up highway miles can not be overstated. My last one was killed by a dude in a Lexus LX.



I loved that car!

I've been looking for the right 9000 for a long time... probably 10 years but it's never quite right. Usually what I find is a perfect car... that's an automatic. Or a high-priced car whose cosmetics don't justify the price. I thought I was being too picky and nearly pulled the trigger last month on a white '94, but I took a weekend to think about it, and then it was gone.

But, finally, patience paid off and I think I got The RIght One.

Being in California, there are two things to consider: -1995 cars means the smog requirements are quite low, and there's no practical limitations on modifications you can do. I mean, there are plenty of limitations but they wouldn't be issues for me, so whatever. But, earlier car probably means TCS, which sucks. OTOH, 1996+ cars get rid of TCS but then you have a pile of OBDII restrictions to deal with. No great answer.

So, this is a '95, and I gotta deal with TCS. :)

But first, it needs a head gasket...



That's not worth complaining about!

I've got a head from a '98 900SE in the garage, so I'll drop that by the machine shop. Hopefully have this car back on the road in a week or two.

It would be great if it I could find some non-TCS parts in the interim, but if I've gotta make two passes I will. Working on little B234s in big-*** 9000 engine bays is not a big deal!
 

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So much different and yet the same on my 94. Have you thought about using the B235 gasket on it?
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I think the only way to do that on a stock car is to double up the gaskets or shave the pistons. Otherwise the pistons will hit the head - even then you end up with very high compression ratio.

I'd love to do a T7 hybrid right now, but I can't take on that much work. I'm knee-deep in an SPG... I shouldn't have even bought this, but I didn't want to pass on it and then have to wait until another showed up. So, My goal is really get this thing back on the road with a minimum of effort.

I imagine sorting out the TCS system is going to take some time & effort too. I'm very out of touch on the newer 9000s, so there will be a learning curve! I emailed Ultima to see if they can still rebuild TCS TBs... it may be spending $400 there is part of the fastest path to no warning lights. :)

But (I hope) I don't need to deal with that until it's at least running right again. I pulled that '98 900SE off a junkyard car in 45 minutes, so it shouldn't take more than a couple hours to fix. (HA!)
 

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Cometic can cut MLS to match the fiber one. I was not aware that the cylinder seals were thinner on the 235. I have a spare fiber one and may grab a 235 gasket to compare. Anyway, I am just thinking ahead on my turbo project.

I have TCS wiring and service info in the PDFs on my GDrive. The main difference that I see is the TB and the ABS setup. The T5 communicates for engine speed I believe. What needs to be rebuilt in the TB?
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I'm not sure what's wrong yet. I just pulled the codes this evening:





There is also an intermittent code from the front left ABS sensor... maybe just an old sensor. Even 20 years ago the sensors on the 9000 didn't seem particularly durable. I replaced many of them.

I need to find a list of TCS codes... I may have it somewhere, been a while since I cared!

I also went ahead and drain all the fluids. I didn't want anything contaminated sitting around.



Two gallons of "oil" and one gallon of "coolant" - exactly what you want!
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 · (Edited)
Looks like I only have the PDF for 1993... hopefully the codes are the same....

25721 = Pedal position sensor faulty = temporary limp home mode (DTC schedule 74)
44260 = Vehicle speed signal incorrect = cruise control failure (DTC schedule 83)
44020 = Signals between pins 32 and 29 of the ETC control module and TC/ABS-TC pins 4 and 24 are incorrect = cruise control failure (DTC schedule 81)
D7591 = ETS cannot open throttle to requested position = cruise control failure (DTC schedule 79)

Oddly, for that last code is says see Service Manual 2:5 page 250, but there is no page 250.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Clearly, I love doing head gaskets on cars. This will be my 5th in two years.

The TCS, though, is looking rough. The troubleshooting steps are... intense. But, it looks like I will need to have it running to perform any of them.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
The variety of issues causing the codes is quite confounding! Looking through the diagnostic flowcharts there isn't much in common between these faults...

25721 = pedal position sensor fault
44260 = difference in speed between gearbox sensor and ABS system
44020 = comms between ABS and ETS are wrong
D7591 = cannot open throttle to requested position

The only actual commonality is potentially the ETS module itself, but given the specific nature of the faults it doesn't seem to be some sort of general issue. I think I need to look at the wiring diagrams.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Yeah, agreed. That could potentially explain 44260 and 44020. I can probably diagnose 44260 with Tech 2. The D7591 could be a vacuum problem (hose, solenoid, check valve) or an actual throttle body issue. I'm not too concerned about the 25721 as it's intermittent... but could also be a ground problem.

This is the troubleshooting for D7591:

-Non-return valve bench test (page 43)
-Safety valve bench test (page 40)
-Mechanical and pneumatic throttle body bench test (page 29)
-Throttle body torque test (page 31)
I had no idea this system had a vacuum component. Even Mercedes was using electronic throttle bodies by the mid '90s, and they love vacuum! :D
 

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Congrats Car looks good. A couple of info points passed on to me from a now octogenarian Saab factory (se) mech who still fixes Saabs.
Metal headgaskets have More issues than the earlier fibre ones These allegedly leak form More places and More often :)
TSC problems are mainly from connector issues.. according to a man with 50+ years of Saab wrenching
And even the dreaded TCS Limphome mode can be driven through... reliably. Just stomp the go pedal,
It's almost impossible to drive a slow /light throttle effectively with limphome.. But he claims a heavy throttle foot works.
Dunno tho..I scrapped MY aero due to limphome despite a years work with my Tech 2 contraption and Wayyy too many $$$ parts.
 

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I suspect the metal ones leak because the head is warped or uneven. How much boost can you usually get by with the Elring fiber and metal one?
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Reading through all of the diagnostic schedules, "clean connector" is repeated hilariously frequently. There just aren't that many parts involves on the Trionic cars. I do need to either solve the issue or delete the TCS, as limo home mode restricts you to less than half throttle, and obviously that won't do on an Aero. ;)

Metal head gaskets are a nonstarter for me... Not dealing with that. Ryengoth was talking about the later MLS gaskets, which do offer superior sealing but require pretty much flawless surfaces. But, I'm sticking with stock here... I need the car at least running. I can't have two dead cars in the driveway and maintain my self esteem. :) I've run well over 20psi on the factory composite gaskets without issue... I'm not worried about stock boost with one. The head bolts are probably more of a factor than the gasket IMO.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Also, dropped my spare T5 head off at the machine shop this morning, and ordered in

AJUSA #81012000 Cylinder Head Bolt Set
MOTORAD #228195 Thermostat
NGK #1095 Spark Plug
ÜRO PARTS #7576663 Radiator Hose
ÜRO PARTS #7551187 Radiator Hose
ÜRO PARTS #4395570 Expansion Tank Cap
FEBI #8859324 Timing Chain Guide - Upper
GRAF #240638 Engine Water Pump
ELRING #0261270 Cylinder Head Gasket Kit

Oh, and another $50 DIC. :lol:

This feels like a good 150,000 mile checkup.
 

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Reading through all of the diagnostic schedules, "clean connector" is repeated hilariously frequently. There just aren't that many parts involves on the Trionic cars. I do need to either solve the issue or delete the TCS, as limo home mode restricts you to less than half throttle, and obviously that won't do on an Aero. ;)

Metal head gaskets are a nonstarter for me... Not dealing with that. Ryengoth was talking about the later MLS gaskets, which do offer superior sealing but require pretty much flawless surfaces. But, I'm sticking with stock here... I need the car at least running. I can't have two dead cars in the driveway and maintain my self esteem. :) I've run well over 20psi on the factory composite gaskets without issue... I'm not worried about stock boost with one. The head bolts are probably more of a factor than the gasket IMO.
Geriatric Saab mechs' info has proven Bulletproof over the last 20 + years.
I'd try the foot to the floor approach. Before trusting to what the books claim. May work.. may not .. only way to be sure though :)
Give thought to entirely Deleting TCS.
I wondered (for a short while) IF I should have chosen chosen that route.
But it pretty well requires a Donor car.
There's a few Important $$$ parts involved in the TCS: besides the two vacuum solenoids (easily metered for functionality) .. Tcs specific PCV valve .. Throttle body.. Throttle pedal position potentiometer device ... ABS Ecu.. TCS Ecu.
Tough to find these at this late date in the TCS life cycle tho.

Not fitting fresh chains ? IWIS ones are affordable and if swapped early-ish before they chew up the sprockets and guides can be a life extending move.. it's what I'm up to.

IF you car still has the older style OEM partially threaded Cyl bolts I'd re- use those .
If you don't want to reuse those. Can I have.. maybe even Buy them ?
I'm in vancouver canada so shippings will be a bit pricey.. But worth it, for me at least.

Advise if this is something you wish to consider.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
There's definitely no way the limp-home throttle cable can fully open the butterly. There is only about 40 degrees of travel on the arm. It's clearly visible from the outside.

Deleting TCS from Trionic 5.5 cars is - I understand - much easier than deleting it from earlier cars. The one thing I'm not too clear about is how much of the TCS system you can remove before the ABS goes wonky. I believe the only communication between TCS and ABS is a speed signal from ABS to TCS (feedback loop) and a control signal from TCS to ABS. I'll need find the lobotomy cutoff point. :)

But pedal/throttle body/cable at least gets me to full throttle, and I can sort out the ABS fault over time.

As a rule I won't reuse head bolts when a head gasket has failed - I don't have a way to measure their condition. You're welcome to whatever comes out - they're going straight to the scrap heap. I have a whole pile of them right now!
 
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