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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
2 questions from a future 9K owner

In the 9000 Forum FAQ thread benji9k says this:

Q: "Which engine is best?"
A: 2.3 FPT offers the most right out of the box. 94-97 Aero models are great if they're in god condition, and not abused. Aero/Carlsson models are top-of-the-line performance-wise. Arguments could be made for any engine. The V6 and N/A models are smooth and have great potential, and the turbos are great for easy, simple power.

1- First question:

Why the FPT offers the most right out of the box if it delivers 200HP against 225HP for the Aero?

2- My second question:

Is the FPT (or CSE) engine has the same internal components as the Aero? I mean, I know the Aero has reinforced components in order to support more compression due to a larger turbo. I just want to know if the FPT is a little bit weaker. Do they have the same compression ratio?

Thank you for your precious help!
 

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Everything is Identical its' an ECU mod that makes the Aero 'More" powerfull. Also Plastic add-on Aero Bits hence the "Name".
But that's "Old" news as an Accord V6 will leave most Aeros for Dead.. assuming equal competence at the Wheel :)
 
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Yes, but frankly an Accord V6 will leave an Aston Martin DB5 for dead.

Whichever you go for Rktek, as long as you get a turbocharged version (whether it be LPT or FPT), there are tonne's of bits and pieces to make them go very quick for not much dosh.

:D
 

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Hi,

All 2.3 Turbo engines have identical engine blocks in the the 9k

The difference between the 225 Aero and the 200 FPT is that the Aero has a bigger Turbo AND a different ECU to match in the manual models only. Nothing else.
Note: The Automatic Aero has the 200bhp FPT engine.
Also note that many of last 9k FPT models (1998) had the 225 engines in the manual. Check the serial number B234L = 200bhp & B234R = 225

Confused on the Accord V6. The Accord coupe takes 8.2 secs 0-60. The Aero is 6.5. Or have i taken some bait?:roll:
 

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Discussion Starter #6
skint said:
Note: The Automatic Aero has the 200bhp FPT engine.
Also note that many of last 9k FPT models (1998) had the 225 engines in the manual. Check the serial number B234L = 200bhp & B234R = 225
If I understand well, this means that the letter at the end of B234 (L or R) only stands for a turbocharger and a ECU difference. I just wanna make sure that I can take an FPT model and swap the Garrett turbocharger for a Mitsubishi turbocharger without having any trouble (because I thought the 2 engines had different internal components).

So what you are trying to explain is that if I take a FPT (200bhp) and I change both the turbocharger for a Mitsubishi and the ECU for an Aero, the engine will become as strong as an Aero (225 bhp) without changing anything in the internal engine components? (I think it's not price worth it but I am just curious to know...)
 

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So what you are trying to explain is that if I take a FPT (200bhp) and I change both the turbocharger for a Mitsubishi and the ECU for an Aero, the engine will become as strong as an Aero (225 bhp) without changing anything in the internal engine components? (I think it's not price worth it but I am just curious to know...)
Yes. or you could fit a carlsson ecu to your FPT and get 220hp with the T25 turbo already fitted.
 

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skint said:
The Accord coupe takes 8.2 secs 0-60. The Aero is 6.5. Or have i taken some bait?:roll:
Sorry man, but you did :). The new V6 Coupe (with a 6-speed and a clutch) is a sub 6 second car :eek:.

For me, the Aero is the most beautiful 9000 ever built. The body kit makes the car.
 

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Not to prolong this Accord thing but the new one with a 6 speed does 0-60 in 6.2 and the 1/4 mile in 14.5. Unless you are talking about some sort of new accord for 2006 it would be a tight race.
 

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Basre said:
Everything is Identical its' an ECU mod that makes the Aero 'More" powerfull. Also Plastic add-on Aero Bits hence the "Name".
But that's "Old" news as an Accord V6 will leave most Aeros for Dead.. assuming equal competence at the Wheel :)
You are joking. Are you not? The Accord V6 has 240 horses, vesus 200 for the 9k fpt. That is fine, but do you drive the car reving your SAAB to 5,000 rpm all the time? I have never rev'ed my 9k engine past 4,500 rpm. Neither does the Honda driver do at 6,250 rpm all the time, where he gets all his 240 horse pulling the car. The peak HP is really not very useful to anyone.

What is meaningful is the torque value. We know our 9k turbo has a peak torque value of 235 ft-lb at very low rpm of 1,950. And it stays flat all the way to the mid 4,000 rpm. What is the Honda V6 torque curve? I don't know. But it peaks at only 212 ft-lb/5000 rpm. My guess is it is not very good at low to mid engine revolutions given the peak is so diamal at 5,000 rpm with a 3.0 liter V6.

I'd take my 9k FPT power everwhere across engine speed anyday.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Marrk said:
Yes. or you could fit a carlsson ecu to your FPT and get 220hp with the T25 turbo already fitted.
ok. so how much HP delivers the Aero (with Mitsubishi TD04 turbocharger) and a Carlsson ECU?

Are those cars very uncommon?

Anyway, I suppose a chipped ECU must do the same thing or even better...
 

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Rktek, if you get a chance to test drive a CSE (5M or 4A) and an Aero (5M) that's for sale in the market for comparison you'll see what Yaofeng is talking about in terms of peak torque at the low end. It really is stump-pulling power that needs to be experienced to be believed.

Ironically, I find an automatic CSE (or Aero for that matter) more satisfying to drive especially from stop (strictly in terms of smooth acceleration) because of the non-stop torque that just keeps coming like a freight locomotive. Without having to shift (9K shifters tend to be a bit notchy and the clutch pedal somewhat stiff and sensitive at the catch point), you can easily reach 70-80mph without even really realizing it unless you look down at the speedo.

Having said that, be extra careful about the condition of the auto trannies on either CSE FPT or Aero. The ZF units are not known for robustness and if previous owner(s) were leadfoots or didn't maintain their trannies properly (ie: no regular ATF flushes/changes, constant shifting btwn D and N at redlights and stop signs) then you may find yourself with a tranny that may go south much sooner than you expect.






yaofeng said:
You are joking. Are you not? The Accord V6 has 240 horses, vesus 200 for the 9k fpt. That is fine, but do you drive the car reving your SAAB to 5,000 rpm all the time? I have never rev'ed my 9k engine past 4,500 rpm. Neither does the Honda driver do at 6,250 rpm all the time, where he gets all his 240 horse pulling the car. The peak HP is really not very useful to anyone.

What is meaningful is the torque value. We know our 9k turbo has a peak torque value of 235 ft-lb at very low rpm of 1,950. And it stays flat all the way to the mid 4,000 rpm. What is the Honda V6 torque curve? I don't know. But it peaks at only 212 ft-lb/5000 rpm. My guess is it is not very good at low to mid engine revolutions given the peak is so diamal at 5,000 rpm with a 3.0 liter V6.

I'd take my 9k FPT power everwhere across engine speed anyday.
 

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Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marrk
Yes. or you could fit a carlsson ecu to your FPT and get 220hp with the T25 turbo already fitted.

OK. How much HP delivers the Aero (with Mitsubishi TD04 turbocharger) and a Carlsson ECU? Or put it this way, how much HP delivers a Saab 9000 Carlsson?

Are those cars very uncommon?

Anyway, I suppose a chipped ECU must do the same thing or even better... Am I right?
 

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Yes. or you could fit a carlsson ecu to your FPT and get 220hp with the T25 turbo already fitted.
Sorry this only applies to pre trionic cars before 1993. ;oops: Carlssons are DI/APC governed engines.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Marrk said:
Sorry this only applies to pre trionic cars before 1993. ;oops: Carlssons are DI/APC governed engines.
So there is no Carlsson after 1993. Is that right? And what is DI-APC? (I suppose DI is for Direct ignition cassette). What is APC?
 

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Personally It's not important whether you believe the Accord is Quick..
But you really should drive one for a Couple of Hunderd Miles before you claim the Aero actually better. The Honda Box is several generations better shifting than a Saab..any Saab try it :) Surprised you don''t use your redline, I do in my 9000, almost daily.. Not much point in having it if it's not used... it does go better :)
The Honda power is impressive, yes the torque is lower but Vtech is a darn good facsimile of Boost. .. and contrary to your beliefs lotsa Honda owners run to the rev limiter.. those motors are V smooooth.. it's FUN up there over 6k rpms.. remember, the shifting is as easy a moving the stick around a little.
Remember, Honda Won several Consequtive Formula 1 championships with a Turbo engine.. But they refuse to put one in their production cars... presumably they could IF they wanted to, the Tech Base is undeniably there.
At legal and sorta Legal speeds The Honda WILL leave a decent Saab for dead, acceleration braking and cornering.. it's also significantly more agile in traffic. In 5 th under full boost the Sabb will pull away.. easily, but this is at over 120 mph .. however who really Cares in this age of 'Jail time' for Stupid speeding
 

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Basre said:
Personally It's not important whether you believe the Accord is Quick..
Surprised you don''t use your redline, I do in my 9000, almost daily.. Not much point in having it if it's not used... it does go better :)
We all know that at around 3,500 rpm our 9k does 90 mph or more. I'l like to know what speed you get in your 9k when you redline it everyday and in what stretch of the road in your part of the world. I am just curious.
 

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Actually I was wrong. I took my '95 cse fpt 5 speed to work like I do everyday on I-287 and I-78 in central New Jersey. When conditions permit I take her 90 to 100 mph, like I do everyday. The engine rpm is 3,000 at 90 mph, about 3,100 rpm at 95 and 3,200 rpm at 100mph. I have never driven any of my 9k turbos past 110 mph so I never rev'ed them past 3,500 rpm. Incidentally, this is regardless of a flat stretch of Interstate or a 5 mile uphill. One reason I like my SAAB's so much is they never gasp for air going uphill like so many Japanese cars do.

I am really curious what speed the 9k turbo gets at the redline of 5,500 rpm and beyond.
 

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I brought mine to the little line right after 135, I guess it would be 145? Umm yeah only did that one once, and I have brought it to 135 on other occasions. At about almost red, like 5k is 135 and just about at the limiter was my 145 trip. It was awesome. I think the other guy is talking about revving high in like 1st or 2nd to 5500.
 
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