[jderosa3]

O.K. I have been messing around trying to get this electronic water pump (http://www.geocities.com/saab99ewp/) installed into my wife's 1979 Saab 99. And for never working on a Saab before I think I am doing all right.

The car was quite dismantled and now has since then been put back together almost all the way... I was to test the EWP out but I first need to get everything back together and I have a few small issues I need to take care of first. So please bear with me here because I took some pictures that I need help with.

I hope all goes well from this point. Ready - here we go:

1. I am not sure if I have the correct hose going to this nipple that is located on the "U" shaped tube. It looks as if the hose came from underniether the air filter area but I am unsure. I need a thumbs up or thumbs down on this.

2. I don't know what hose connects to this.... and if I don't have the hose I need to get one.

3. Not sure where this goes to... ;oops:

4. Once again.. I have a hose connected to this but I am not sure where the other end connects to... I assume it goes to the sensore that is located in the manifold that is against the block... am I right?

5. I don't know if this is a sensor on the alternatore or where it suppost to connect to... I have it cliped on the bolt where the white/grey wires bolt onto. (B+)

6. I do not have the "U" bracket that blocks the Fan blades to this... is this a no no :nono; ... or is just to keep fingers (or wires) out of it... Reason is... If I don't absolutely have to attach it back on... I think I will just leave it off.

 

[jderosa3]

continued...

7. I don't know what this part is or where it bolts onto... need help with this for sure... ;oops:

8. Here is a hose that comes off the intake manifold that has a nice sharp bend in the end of it... I have absolutley no idea where it is suppost to connect to.... I looked in the manual for an answer, but I an see the pictures clearly enough to help me out.

9. I have a hose connected to this but I am not sure where the other end connects to... I assume it goes to the sensore that is located in the manifold that is against the block as well (see #4)... am I right?

10. I have a small hose that "Y"s off from this part on the underside of the intake manifold... I don't know where they goto...

11. Another mystery to me...


Well that seems to be about it for the time being. If there is anyone that has pictures they can post or a nice explination on where these items go.. please let me know. All help is obviously appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

Kind Regards,
James DeRosa

 

[Tomarse]

I can help you with some of these!. hopefully somebody else can help with the rest.

2 - a hose should run from this connector to the same size connector that is down on the side of the air box

I do not have items 1, 3 or 4 on my car - so i'm going to guess that they are either some sore of emissions control system or aircon (which we dont have in the UK)

6. I do not have the "U" bracket that blocks the Fan blades to this... is this a no no :nono; ... or is just to keep fingers (or wires) out of it... Reason is... If I don't absolutely have to attach it back on... I think I will just leave it off.

[/quote]

should be fine without (my old car was). make sure that any wires are securely cable tied out of the way though!

 

[Tomarse]

7. I don't know what this part is or where it bolts onto... need help with this for sure... ;oops:

this is a cold start air valve. bolts to the side of the cylinder head. in the biddle between the 2 banks of the inlet manifold. it doesn quite sit perfectly central but kinda next to the temperature sensor thing that bolts through the inlet manifold.
should be attached to 2 pipes that go to either side of the throttle butterfly in the inlet manifold. One of the pipes is pictured below!
is fitted with the tallest side upwards.

8. Here is a hose that comes off the intake manifold that has a nice sharp bend in the end of it... I have absolutley no idea where it is suppost to connect to.... I looked in the manual for an answer, but I an see the pictures clearly enough to help me out.

This is one side of the cold start valve! - see the above item.

11. Another mystery to me...

one of these could be for the other side of the cold start valve?

Your engine has so many more bits to it than mine!

Well that seems to be about it for the time being. If there is anyone that has pictures they can post or a nice explination on where these items go.. please let me know. All help is obviously appreciated.

Have a read through Nutcase's and my big threads and see if we have any pictures of the engine there. our 99T's are a bit simpler than yours though.
I had a quick look through my pics and couldnt see any useful ones but i'm sure nutcase will have had some!

 

[nutcase]

Righty-oh (cracks knuckles) let's see what we can sort out! I'll try and keep in order as much as possible, and try and find some pictures later...

1) Can't really tell whats going on there. However, I can answer part of the question in no. 2

2) The larger nipple goes to the airfilter housing as queried in no. 1. The smaller nipple should probably be blanked off.

3) No idea, not seen one like that before! edit - see below

4) On mine this goes to the boost gauge on the dash. Or an economy guage on some models. Possibly it could connect to the smaller nipple on no. 2

5) This is a capacitor for removing any electrical interference from the alternator. You have connected it correctly.

6) You really ought to have the U bracket for safety's sake, but the car will work without it. JohnW has a picture somewhere of what happens to fingers that touch the alternator blades...

7) This bolts on to the inlet manifold (via a bracket) just below where no. 2 is. I'll try and find a picture.

8) The end connects to one pipe of number 7.

9) Not sure...

10) Can't make out what's there I'm afraid.

11) One of those goes to the other end of number 7. The other on mine is plugged. edit - see below

 

[Tomarse]

I think you got a couple more than me there! ;oops:

This post is the perfect example of why you can never take too many pictures of stuff BEFORE you take it apart! :lol:

 

[nutcase]

A couple of pictures. Remember that because mine is a turbo there will be a some difference in pipework.

 

[nutcase]

Ok, number 3 connects to the top pipe of number 11 (the bottom pipe going to one port of number 7 as already said). Number 3 is a vacuum operated valve. Presumedly it opens when the throttle is closed to allow a bit of air bypass.

 

[jderosa3]

Thank you!

I see what you guys mean when you say to take pictures of something before you take it apart... unfortunatley the wife had this car taken to a specialist who did not reassemble the car... so I was stuck with the probelm of rebuiling the engine.

So I guess most of this was all answered except for a few small details...

1. so number one is a mystery to all... could I block the nipple off to see if it causes issues?

10. this photo isn't that great, but it look like a carborator type device bolted onto the underside of the intake manifold... (it was really oily and gunked up... ) but there was a small nipple on it that has two hoses y'ed off from it... I may just remove these for now...

I think this may set me strait but I will let you guys know for sure what happens... hopefully my EWP installed right...

now I have to fill up the radiator with some water to test it out then I will drain and refill with a cleaner and reflush and then refill with an antirust product... alot of work but I really dn't want to do this again. (nutcase do you have pics of where i drain the radiator.. I know where the bleeder valve is on top where the heater core is...

Is it alright to use feul injector cleaners on an older car like this for a once over to make sure all is nice and tidy? I was also thinking about cleaning the engine bay with an engine degreaser... It will make it quite wet in there but I do it to my VW and it seems to never hurt it... I just want to get this thing spit shined after im done. :cheesy:

Thank you all for your help! It is greatly appreciated...

Kind Regards,
James DeRosa

 

[Naranto]

Can't help with your hoses - but would recommend paint brush CLEANER (B&Q or Wickes) as an engine cleaner as its much cheaper than engine cleaners such as Gunk and twice as effective.

 

[jderosa3]

Thanks - I'll check into that... I was more curious if the cleaner would hurt anything.. I thought it would be pretty safe...

 

[Naranto]

Nope, the cleaner has no negative effect on anything plastic or metal. Just to clarify, this is the liquid (usually blue) used to clean paint out of brushes prior to washing under the tap.

 

[jderosa3]

Awesome - thanks for the info!

 

[nutcase]

If you can get a better picture of no1 and no 10 we might be able to decipher/blind guess

There's two points to drain the coolant - on the radiator, right at the bottom towards the left hand edge when sitting in the car looking forward (unless you have an aftermarket radiator, as a lot don't have the tap (cheapskates!).

The second point is fun to find. Below the exhaust manifold is two hex headed bolts. One huge one (about 30mm accross) and just under that a smaller one (about 17mm across). That smaller one is the block drain. The bigger one is for a block heater. Use an antifreeze that is designed to be good with mixed metallurgy engines (i.e. alloy head, iron block) - a good one to use is Comma Xstream Green as it has the same addative as the genuine Saab, Mercedes etc. stuff. BASF Glysantin I think?

Injector cleaner should be fine.

 

[jderosa3]

Major Problems!

O.k. well the install of everything went well... I got mostly everything back in and ready to go... but now I have some major issues:

First let me explain that this car sat for over a year and a half without running... thats when the water pump went and needed to be replaced...

I testes the EWP and there are no leaks to be seen, but I tried to start the car (so I can warm it up and make the coolant flow so that I can flush it)...
I get a terrible clicking sound... the alternator shows no indication of turning and it sounds to me like the starter...

keep in mind though I am no mechanic (but that doesn't mean that ?i beat things needlessly with hammers either :lol: ).

I was told that it could be a bad celinoid or the battery isn't charged well enough to turn the engine...

to rule out the battery problem.. I charged the battery for over a day and even after that didn't work I/ tried jumping the car with my VW jetta (brand new... with a nice chagred battery) - no luck there.

so now I don't know what to do.. I just want to get this thing running. Nutcase I'm looking in your direction for help

I have a video of my engine bay with sound while I am trying to start the car (3/4 times...) so you can hear what it is doing....)

the video is huge though... 96 MB... if you are on broadband and don't mind the DL time.. please check it out and tell me what you think... it is the best way for me to let you hear what is going on.

Right click the link below and save the file to your desktop:

http://www.jimderosa.com/upload/neww/MOV01574.MPG

Thanksfor the help...

Kind Regards,
James DeRosa

 

[jderosa3]

few more install pics

here are a few more pics also...

Not sure where this connects to...

here is the part that has the y coming off of it...

the ewp installed...

now i just need to get this running properly...

hope I can get a few more answers outta you guys

 

[nutcase]

Will have to come back to the running thing - for a start I don't have a soundcard installed at the minute!

But, I did wonder, but wasn't sure, but now am (does that make sense?!). The first two of the new pics show 1) Thermostatic valve and 2) EGR Valve. Exhaust Gas Recirculation system.

From the EGR valve, there should be the hose with the Y, and each branch of the Y should have a valve attached. One then leads to a port underneath the throttle body (the one heading left looks like it is already heading that way) and the other goes to one of the ports on the thermostatic valve.

The hose in no 9 on your first set of pics then goes to the other port on that thermostatic valve.

A couple of things to try with starting the engine - put the car in gear and push it forwards a little to move things a bit. If that doesn't work, try a sharp tap on starter motor with a wooden mallet.

 

[jderosa3]

more info...

nutcase... i have to laugh :lol: ... because i will do what i can to get this car moving - there is one problem though... the car has a bad tirerod end... so i don't want to push the car at the moment...
i don't mind giving it a little tap with a wooden mallet... but how exactly do i get to the starter...

I was told I have to take off the passanger side wheel and jack the car up... there should be an under belly pan that must be removed and in this area is the starter...

does the noise i described make this sound like a starter problem?... I also think i need to clean out the fuel injector part...

they say if the car sits for a while that this will get gunked up and need cleaned...

i hope after all of this i don't need a fuel pump either... i think i am making progress in general... let me know your thoughts on all things I should check... and what i will do is follow your lead... I will give you a detailed explination of what goes on...

thanks...

 

[jderosa3]

man no sound card.... :suprised;

like i said the only way i can describe the sound is a terrible clicking/knocking sound... also - the alternator shows no indication of turning when the car is trying to be started...

 

[Tomarse]

have you tested that you have the basics like fuel and a spark and that your timing is correct?.

If it has sat for a long while it will take a bit of turning over before the fuel gets through. You can force the fuel pump to run all the time if you replace its relay (which is a tall 5 pin one) with a standard 4 pin one. It might be an idea to loosen a biot of fuel pipe in the engine bay, after the filter and then run the pump until fuel comes out.
I think that the ignition may need to be on (just in the first position) to do this.

You can also take the injectors out and clean them up with carb cleaner.

If you want to ensure that your injectors are working and not blocked (and get fuel up to them):

- pull the injector out of the engine (but leave all the pipes connected)
- put it in a clear jam jar or similar
- Take the big rubber cap off the fuel distributor. lift the flap in the top of it, and wedge it slightly open with a chock of some sort (the more this is lifted the more fuel will spray out - but when it is fully down the injectors will do nothing). Or get a willing assistant to move the flap for you. you can grip it with a socket on and extension twisted onto the nut visible in the centre.
- now force the fuel pump to go on and fuel should spray out of the injectors while the flap is open.



If your alternator is not spimnning then it doies sound like the starter isnt doing its job. It should be under the exhaust manifold if it is the same as the turbo. You can probably reach it from underneath or the side without removing anything.
If the solenoid on it is stuck, it will not engage the gears proberly and thus not spin the engine over.


I have also left your file downloading. will have a listen when it arrives!