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  #1  
Old 10th October 2012
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Default Abbott-tuned, hitting fuel cutoff (I think)

Sup guys. I bought a tuned 9000 Aero back in May which ran fine, but had some low boost issues. Turned out it the the BPC valve which I replaced and now it boosts 1/4 past read on WOT. Great, I say! The problem is that I'm hitting fuel cutoff at times, and the boost pulses some when I'm really getting into the throttle. I'm not sure if the guy before me upgraded the FPR or not; could this cause this? Furthermore how can I tell if it's the upgraded one or not?

I'm pretty sure the injectors are the same; I'm kindof blind as far as what stage the software is actually at, but it walks my 9-5 Aero so I'm guessing it's at a stage 3. Hardware is big Abbott intercooler and delivery pipe, Forge recirc valve, K&N intake, 3" downpipe and exhaust.

Unfortunately, the guy had to sell the car because of hardship, and he was very emotionally attached to it. He was really sad to see it go and entertained some of the questions I had early on after I got it; ultimately he said he had to move on in his mind so I didn't contact him anymore because it was clearly upsetting him.
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  #2  
Old 10th October 2012
VT9000CSE VT9000CSE is offline
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I turned off my fuel cut in overboost on my T5 Suites tuned Stage 3 ECU. Much better. It overshoots past full red then settles in nicely. I did the T7 valve conversion.
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  #3  
Old 11th October 2012
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Could be a sticky APC/BPC valve. Ws it a new one, if not, have you cleaned the ports.

http://forum.ecuproject.com/showthre...aning-a-T5-BCV

YOu should not get to fuel cut.
It means something is wrong, far too much boost or something radically wrong with the tune and the ECU can not get the knocking under control so cuts the fuel to save the engine.
It the last resort for the ECU to save the engine.
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  #4  
Old 11th October 2012
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Some people mistake fuel cut for knock, I hope you are not mixing up the two. Knock is a tad bit more detrimental than fuel cut!
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Old 11th October 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KaMiKaZi_t0M View Post
Some people mistake fuel cut for knock, I hope you are not mixing up the two. Knock is a tad bit more detrimental than fuel cut!
Good to see you are still on here KaMikaZi_tOM.
I've never really figured your name out, but seems to me like you must have some exciting driving techniques!

"knock" sure can be detrimental.

I think Yes and No to this post.
I was a bit unclear in previous post.

Fuel cut is the last resort for saving the engine from dangerous, "knock".

If the engine gets into knock, the first thing the ecu does is
richen the fuel, (this cools things)
second, retard the timing,
third pull off the boost.

If for some reason the enigne keeps boosting too high then the ECU senses the high boost and cuts the fuel.
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  #6  
Old 11th October 2012
John Z Williams John Z Williams is offline
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From the ones I have seen, they turn the fuel cut up, but not off, so it sounds like the bpc could be over-boosting, you need to get a boost gage on the car and see what its actually boosting. Should be around 20psi. If its more, then you have a sticky bpc, they go bad all the time or your base boost is set too high or your wastegate actuator is damaged.

It could be quench or weak fuel pump too, have seen this, you need a new set of ngk bcpr 7es plugs with the .75mm plug gap !

I saw some early abbott tunes and they were the forge 10psi actuator and then they would turn off the fuel cut and that was it.

All three of my Saabs had weak fuel pumps, two 9000's and on ng900, the air fuel would lean out from the weak fuel pump. My 9k aero would run 14.2 under wot, new fuel pump, 11.5 :-)

John
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  #7  
Old 12th October 2012
VT9000CSE VT9000CSE is offline
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My fuel cut is definately turned OFF. I set the MAP pressure for fuel cut in T5 Suites from 0xFE (1.54 bar) to 0xFF (1.55 bar) which turns off fuel cut. My old T25 would overshoot past red line on boost gauge in 5th at 2000 rpm on the highway when going up hill and flooring it. But it used to hit fuel cut due to this overshoot. Once I turned off fuel cut the overshoot still occurs, then the APC system corrects it and brings it to a stable boost level. This overshoot acts like a little extra power initially then settles down to the correct level. The fuel cut really is a joke cause the little baby T25 cannot keep up boost levels after the rpms hit around 4000+. Stage 3 tune with a max pressure limit set to 1.35 bar ~19 psi. SWEEEEEEET.
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  #8  
Old 13th October 2012
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Well this problem is moot for the moment. Car won't start :mad:

I've got another thread about it here.. Thanks guys.
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  #9  
Old 13th October 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VT9000CSE View Post
My fuel cut is definately turned OFF. I set the MAP pressure for fuel cut in T5 Suites from 0xFE (1.54 bar) to 0xFF (1.55 bar) which turns off fuel cut. My old T25 would overshoot past red line on boost gauge in 5th at 2000 rpm on the highway when going up hill and flooring it. But it used to hit fuel cut due to this overshoot. Once I turned off fuel cut the overshoot still occurs, then the APC system corrects it and brings it to a stable boost level. This overshoot acts like a little extra power initially then settles down to the correct level. The fuel cut really is a joke cause the little baby T25 cannot keep up boost levels after the rpms hit around 4000+. Stage 3 tune with a max pressure limit set to 1.35 bar ~19 psi. SWEEEEEEET.
I wonder why it overboosts?
and if the T25 is going too high I thought that all it would be doing is heating up the intake charge, not providing extra boost, but causing overheat which would create 'knock" conditions.

Correct me if I am not understanding the process correctly.

And I would have thought, like JZW, that there is something wrong with the BPC/APC valve, to cause the overboost.

I have read, and had 2nd hand experience (from a guy whose ECU I did a wizard tune on) of this valve performing much better after the valve ports have been cleaned.
Some have said, clean it about every 6 months, at other regular intervals, like oil change time.

Rbn
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  #10  
Old 6th December 2018
SaabKidd23 SaabKidd23 is offline
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Hello everyone. Sorry to bring this thread back up but my 92 9000 turbo is doing this. It will start to get into boost and get towards the end of the red then start to hit what seems to be boost cut or fuel cut . But as soon as it gets past about 4k boost will die down and it will clear up and start to pull hard.. also I do have the wastegate turned up a bit and a manual boost controller in a way. Maybe I need new spark plugs? Or is my fuel pump weak? I have a video if there's anyway to send it.
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  #11  
Old 6th December 2018
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Has it only started doing this, or have you been adjusting the settings?

How does the boost valve work. I am only familiar with T5 T7 valves, which you don't have.

If you have lifted base boost past the recommendation, it can mess with the boost system.

If it is a violent "fuel cut" it probably means that the engine is "detonating". Hence cutting the boost to "save the engine". If the MBC is too open it can cause this.

But we are working in the dark without more info, history.

I have really only done ECU tuning on 9000 Trionic ECUs.
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  #12  
Old 6th December 2018
SaabKidd23 SaabKidd23 is offline
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I may have it open a bit to much. But ive had this same settup through out the summer and fall and it never did it so bad until it started to get real cold outside. I really think I'm just lacking fuel and that's what I need to upgrade. Since my Saab is know as jetronic/trionic T5.2 engine management apparently it's untunable? I really love my Saab and want to make more power out of it.. is there any other way I can do this? Or is it kind of a plug and play kinda car as long as the air fuel is right? I saw online there's a txsuite to tune saabs but idk how I'd go about doing that.
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Old 6th December 2018
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If it is T 5.2, that means it is the early Trionic system that was the for runner of T5.5.

My 93 Griffin is T5.2. I tuend it using T5 Suite (worked on by many volunteers who

reverse engineered the software)

I used the wizard tune function to tune my own ecu, then I modified it a little more. I also used the T5 suite to tune my 9000 CD, as well as a few others.

However, it a while since I did it.
But I know this there was a lot of learning to do, which I did via "The Ecuproject" Website. I think the website might not be working now, it is yers since I went on it. But I think there was a similar website with the same people in it. I think it was called Trionic Tuning, but I could be wrong.

By far the best war to tune Trionic cars is to tune the ECU, that preserves the inbuilt safety systems, which you are discovering.

robin
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  #14  
Old 8th December 2018
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After 4000 RPMS your turbo is out of its efficiency zone, which will naturally cause the boost pressure to drop. With using a MBC you are most likely developing too much boost down low, coupled with the stock timing advance the computer is causing a fuel cut condition. Dial back boost, or as rawill suggested join us at trionictuning.com and learn how to really tune your saab!
Tom
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  #15  
Old 9th December 2018
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Top class advice. Great to see you on here again Tom. I have been away a while.

Just sold my 07 93, but still have 3 Saabs, including my 93 Griffin that I used T5 suite to tune.

T5 suite is a very smart bit of software, which I was happy to help out Dilemma and the team with on the documentation, in a very small way.
I never progressed to T7 and above.

Great to see Trionictuning.com is still up and running.
Must go over and have a look and see if I am still a member there after so long away.

And,Saabkid23, there is still a lot of info online from ECUproject.com. You will find me there, same user name, and KaMiKaZi_tOM as well I think.
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Last edited by rawill; 9th December 2018 at 02:11 PM.
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Old 9th December 2018
SaabKidd23 SaabKidd23 is offline
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Awesomeness thank you guys soo much!! I very much appreciate all the help guys!! I would love to have an actual tuned Saab!! The MBC stuff sucks haha I will go check out those websites for you guys! Asap. Is there a specific wire I have to use to connect my computer to my car?
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  #17  
Old 9th December 2018
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Hi Saabkid

No it is a bit more complicated than that.
However, when you get there, get T5 Suite. Read up the documentation.
Take your time. It takes a bit to get your head around, well it did for me.
Maybe that says something.

You need a little bit of hardware, to connect to your computer and the ECU.
Maybe a bit tricky to get now, not sure. Maybe they have improved them.
Steve Hayes, Mackan, Dilemma, Just4leisure, are some of the names to look out for, well they were back when I delved into this and figured out how to do it, with lots of help from the ECUproject guys and girls.

Then you reflash the ECU with the "Bin" you have selected, if you want to do that.

I used the Wizard tune to Stage II my Griffin, then made a few little mods.
The programme alters the boost, timing and fueling.

Happy reading, and learning.
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Old 9th December 2018
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaabKidd23 View Post
Awesomeness thank you guys soo much!! I very much appreciate all the help guys!! I would love to have an actual tuned Saab!! The MBC stuff sucks haha I will go check out those websites for you guys! Asap. Is there a specific wire I have to use to connect my computer to my car?
Yes it does, in all sorts of ways, but don't get me started. They do have their uses, I just don't think so on a Saab. And JZW would feel the same I am sure.
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Old 14th December 2018
SaabKidd23 SaabKidd23 is offline
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Hello guys so I figured out my problem it was my direct injection cartridge. I swapped it out and my car holds 22 psi under 4000k like nothin then starts to die off after that. Well tonight I ran into another issue... My t25 turbo went poo on me sadly. There's a ton of blue smoke coming out of my exhaust but it still spools up pretty good. Does anyone know what turbo I should upgrade to? I'm looking for a td04- 20t with a t25 flange but can't find one anywhere for a decent price.. does anybody have any turbos for sale? Thanks guys😃
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Old 14th December 2018
SaabKidd23 SaabKidd23 is offline
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Hello guys so I figured out my problem it was my direct injection cartridge. I swapped it out and my car holds 22 psi under 4000k like nothin then starts to die off after that. Well tonight I ran into another issue... My t25 turbo went poo on me sadly. There's a ton of blue smoke coming out of my exhaust but it still spools up pretty good. Does anyone know what turbo I should upgrade to? I'm looking for a td04- 20t with a t25 flange but can't find one anywhere for a it price.. does anybody have any turbos for sale? Thanks guys😃
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