Yankton & MapTun produce over 500HP and Torque! - SaabCentral Forums
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NG900 & OG9-3 Performance, Mods & Tuning Covers Tuning & Performance modifications for the NG900 (1994 to 1998) & OG9-3 (1999-2002) & '03 Convertible

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  #1  
Old 27th May 2006
kyankton kyankton is offline
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Default Yankton & MapTun produce over 500HP and Torque!

It was an eventful day at the dyno with the project WaSaabi producing at the wheel 445 max HP and 443 lb/ft torque which is over 500 at the crank on a stock bottom end. We were doing runs in 3rd gear but the tires kept spinning on the dyno under full boost. So, we had to switch to 4th gear runs to get the results you see. MapTun produced in the end the power potential of the engine. I highly recommend them. I will post a video of the dyno run in the next couple days so that you can also get a feel for the power. Its amazing!!!

http://www.kyankton.net/saabng900/dyno_runs.htm#

Stock -


MapTuned


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  #2  
Old 27th May 2006
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lms lms is offline
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Wow-good job! A saab with 500 at the crank is amazing.
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  #3  
Old 27th May 2006
zer0daze zer0daze is offline
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nice numbers
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  #4  
Old 27th May 2006
John Z Williams John Z Williams is offline
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Great numbers I can's believe you are making peak power around 4500rpm, shoot that is about where I make peak power with my t28/gt28r turbo, right at about 4500rpm. No 7k rev limit? What turbo did you end up going with?

That looks like a monster and I would love a chance to feel that power unload on the open road Great job,
Any chance of seeing the a/f on that run???
John
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  #5  
Old 27th May 2006
Vigge Vigge is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Z Williams
Great numbers I can's believe you are making peak power around 4500rpm,
John
say what?, ~5700 is where I see it. peak torque around 4500
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  #6  
Old 27th May 2006
John Z Williams John Z Williams is offline
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OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOPPPPPPPPPPPPSSSSSSSSSSSS,

You are right, I need to slow down as I peruse these graphs... Yea max torque at 4500 and max hp at 5700rpm. I would think a 7k rev limit would be a necessity with that high of power band... Maybe he has it, just did not want to push it after the power started to fall a little...

John
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  #7  
Old 27th May 2006
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mike saunders mike saunders is offline
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There's no need to rev high with the 2.3L...The extra 800-1200 RPM at the top isn;t really going to gain you that much.

The .86 A/R turbine wheel and high degree of head porting are likely responsible for the late spoolup...but deliver the blue-ribbon dyno numbers.

That's an excellent way to start the summer...
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  #8  
Old 27th May 2006
kyankton kyankton is offline
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Thanks guys! Another thing to consider is that we did the runs in 4th gear which does not necessarily represent how a person would drive the car. You would almost always be in the 3000 plus rpm range and thus have the turbo power readily on tap for full exploitation. It definitely prefers to be on the open road verses stop and go. There have been a few times already where I have stalled the car leaving a light, but that has not stopped me from driving it. The torque number came in much higher than expected. I didn't think we would hold 500 lb/ft of torque in reaching 500 hp. Now that much hp on 225's makes for an interesting launch with a lot of smoke. Oh well, they were free tires anyway.
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  #9  
Old 27th May 2006
John Z Williams John Z Williams is offline
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I need to re-check his site, I thought it might be a 2.0, but a 2.3 is designed to be a torque monster. You are right, he was starting to lose power anyway after about 6000rpm. That was the long 4th gear pull too!!! Spinning on the dyno in third, that must be some awesome power eh! He has a 76mm compressor wheel, I can't even imagine what that sounds like and or feels like on the road, but I bet it will put a sense of fear into you. Did he do the lsd on that one? I was thinking about our cars and how they perform well in some situations and not so well in others and I realized that Mike's 550bhp Saab 9-3 put down a 13.0 flat 1/4 mile time. That Alyex ran a 13.4 with 270bhp estimate and I might be able to get my 338bhp ng900 into the 13's at sea-level with race gas and some weight saving technics. This goes to show that traction is a huge part of 1/4 mile times and that even with monster 550bhp power, times into the 12's is hard to do and that is dissapointing to me. Just think if we could race some of those same cars that put down 11-12 second times from a roll at 30mph or the sweet spot in second gear, I bet we would hold our own fairly well and beat some of those faster cars some of the time too... Our one-wheel-front wheel drive cars are just not designed for off the line performance, especially with our first gears being so bad, as soon as the turbo begins to spool, it spins and hits the rev-limit and you go nowhere. I noticed when I tried a couple of runs, I would spin, bounce off the rev-limit and then shift, I was about 20mph and too low for good reaction in second gear, then bog, then finally spool again. I would like to find a decent forum for our cars where we could let them shine as they were desgined to do on the open highway in the twisties. Road-racing would be a better fit for our cars I think and I am going to try some open track nights at the road course instead of the 1/4 mile track where I know I have bad limitations. The other reason being its so dang hard on your clutch and drive-train in 1/4 mile. I want to do this as a daily driver/track car/hobby and find a forum where I can have some fun and be somewhat competative. I would think Kevin's car would do pretty darn good on a track and that might be the best way to have some fun, do some racing and then drive your car home after the day is over at the track.

John
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  #10  
Old 27th May 2006
Vigge Vigge is offline
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Nice numbers Kevin, do you think you could fix up some free way accelration times, like the 100-200km/h?

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Z Williams
I need to re-check his site, I thought it might be a 2.0, but a 2.3 is designed to be a torque monster.
the more displacement you have the lower the turbo will pick up, cause you pass more air. These would mean more boost in lower rpms = more torque.
You can get big torque numbers from a 2.0 also, but its just going to happen later in the rpm range.

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Z Williams
I was thinking about our cars and how they perform well in some situations and not so well in others and I realized that Mike's 550bhp Saab 9-3 put down a 13.0 flat 1/4 mile time. That Alyex ran a 13.4 with 270bhp estimate and I might be able to get my 338bhp ng900 into the 13's at sea-level with race gas and some weight saving technics. This goes to show that traction is a huge part of 1/4 mile times and that even with monster 550bhp power, times into the 12's is hard to do and that is dissapointing to me.
the is alot things which affect the quarter mile time, so look at the trap speed instead. For instance a 9k last year put down 11,59/205.3 with 477hp and some weight reduction.

When did 9-3 mike do a 1/4mile run? To quote his own words his goals with that car where never on the strip.
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Z Williams
Just think if we could race some of those same cars that put down 11-12 second times from a roll at 30mph or the sweet spot in second gear,
you can pretty much forget 2nd gear acceleration with 500bhp FWD car.
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  #11  
Old 27th May 2006
John Z Williams John Z Williams is offline
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I guess you are right, I have gotten used to easing into my power band in second gear and this keeps it from spinning with my 302wtrq uncorrected, so I guess much more torque would equate to more wheel spin. I watched Mike's videos and he is spinning at what looks like 70-80mph... I think you could learn to ease into the throttle and keep it from spinning so bad and get better use of the power band with some practice.

I spotted his car on dragstrip.com

http://www.dragtimes.com/browse3.php...b&carmodel=all

John
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  #12  
Old 27th May 2006
Vigge Vigge is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Z Williams

I spotted his car on dragstrip.com

http://www.dragtimes.com/browse3.php...b&carmodel=all

John
I know he drow 8.8s/138km/h 201m last summer, but AFAIK the 402m time and trap speed are based on calculations.
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  #13  
Old 27th May 2006
DFroelich DFroelich is offline
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it looks like you could really benefit from a higher redline for the 1-2 and 2-3 shifts. Maybe falling out of the torque curve there helps with traction?
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  #14  
Old 27th May 2006
John Z Williams John Z Williams is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vigge
I know he drow 8.8s/138km/h 201m last summer, but AFAIK the 402m time and trap speed are based on calculations.
I am not sure what you mean, what is afaik? Are you saying the 1/4 mile time is an estimate and not the actual track speed? He had a 2.0 60' too!!!

I saw two 9000's put down 1.9's like Alex Slaab's 1.9 60' and 13.4 1/4mile et.

That tells me there is a way to get a Saab into the 1.9's for 60' 1/4 mile racing. Weight, suspension, slicks or drag radial, weight, staging, good RT's
100-104 race gas and maybe some water-co2 or no2 ic sprayer to hit it right before the run. 13's are possible with a little money, determination and desire. And maybe some replacement parts too

John
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  #15  
Old 29th May 2006
victorspecial victorspecial is offline
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AFAIK- as far as I know.
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  #16  
Old 29th May 2006
zer0daze zer0daze is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DFroelich
it looks like you could really benefit from a higher redline for the 1-2 and 2-3 shifts. Maybe falling out of the torque curve there helps with traction?
why? the torque is falling on its face. if if was going to be spun higher it would totally need cams.
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  #17  
Old 29th May 2006
John Z Williams John Z Williams is offline
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I thought about that and my car has a similar power curve, just does not go up that extra 150whp... That was a 4th gear pull, I wonder if he still has good power in second and third gear? I know my car still pulls pretty hard all the way to 7k in second gear, 5800 or so in third and about 5200 in 4th.

I think he did do cam gears and maybe cams too, can't remember...
John
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  #18  
Old 29th May 2006
PureViggen PureViggen is offline
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yo daze......this is the setup i have been chatting with maptun about for my vig........and im jsut glad to see it worked out for kevin.....def. monster power in a great platform....i cant wait until i have the money to do it...



nice work kevin....i have been watching your car for a long time...i even have the EuropeanCar mag. you were in(when you werent running right i assume because you didnt have any #s down) sitting in my cdBOOKlet so i can look at my future setup anytime i want...

....congrats. on a great setup/numbers :tup:
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  #19  
Old 29th May 2006
PureViggen PureViggen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zer0daze
why? the torque is falling on its face. if if was going to be spun higher it would totally need cams.
oh and i will be running cams/ cam gears and possibly boring it to 2.35 or 2.4 liters..........i have been researching this, and sofar nothing has helped me find a conclusive answer......oh and if you want a high hp/TQ FWD car in the 12s you need no weight, sticky tires and for us, most likely, upgraded front axles/driveshafts......otherwise yo run 12.5 and leave your front end halfway behind you on the track.
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  #20  
Old 29th May 2006
DFroelich DFroelich is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zer0daze
why? the torque is falling on its face. if if was going to be spun higher it would totally need cams.
Sure its falling, but it is still much higher than the landing torque if he shifts at 6400.

Option A - 6400 shiftpoint
1-2 shift.... ~340 to ~150 tq
2-3 shift.... ~340 to ~275 tq

Option C - 7000 shiftpoint (extropolate the curve)
1-2 shift... ~290 to ~190 tq
2-3 shift.... ~290 to ~410 tq

Apparently, 7000 is not the ideal shiftpoint, but something higher than 6400rpm should give more total torque throughout 2nd and 3rd. Remember...its not landing, peak, or shiftpoints that describes your power, but the area under that curve.
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