to sell or not to sell - mods this is not an advert!

[Murray]

I find myself in the undeniably attractive position of owning 3 APCs, 2 black, one red! The red on is currently sat on my computer desk in front of me and one of the black ones is tuned (currently in my black car which the red one came in!)

i have just watched one sell on ebay for £109 the dilema i have now is do i sell my red box and keep using the tuned black one! this would be great as funds towards the white car! but i am not sure about getting rid of it! it sounds nice when i describe it in my black car as being "Red box" lol

Please please help!!

[ejenner]

You could just put the red-box on the APC thats in your black car. Or you could spray the black one red. I sold my red-box that came with my carlsson but I did that because I thought I was going to buy a Motec ECU. I did buy a Motec so it worked out ok - I don't need any APC now.

[ubermich]

Which performs better, the red box or the modded black box? Stick with whichever works best. If the black is best but you want a red box, paint it! IMO function>form especially when you can't see the form until you pop the hood. I really woudln't care if my APC was hot pink if it performed.

[Si]

Have you opened the red box up yet?

You've only got a phone camera have'nt you?

I've got some high quality photos of the black APC circuit board somewhere, would be nice to have some of the red box too, make some comparisions and see which components are different.

While you've got it sitting there you should pop them both open side by side and see if you can see the differences, then you can make up your own red boxes (or PM me the pics so i can )

Can't seem to find my pic's anywhere

[Murray]

I gotta be honest, i havent played with the pots yet, i have just done the resistor and the wire mod on the black box, it pulls harder and longer than the red one and generally feels stronger!

I will have my digi camera back again shortly so i will take some photos, think i am going to sell the red box, i dont use it anymore and it will give me some nice cash to use towards getting whitey back on the road!!

Someone is interested in my rear wiper motor too so thats nearly a years road tax sorted out between the 2 of them!!

Si, i will post the photos here and on my website (full size files on the site) so you can use them if you want, camera is a canon 5.5mp so the quality should be sorted!

[Si]

Where's the smiley with a thumbs up when you need one .

I gotta get my uber APC sorted, will have to sort it out in the next few weeks while the cars off the road i suppose, loads of soldering to do .

[Murray]

Uber APC? sounds interesting! care to enlighten?

[RM '92 SPG]

Hi,

Keep the red! I have a redbox in my SPG, and it still feels better than a fully modified standard box. And besides, if you ever want to sell it down the road, it's not going to be worth any less, you have your 109 pounds safely stored in your engine bay.

-Rob

[Si]

Rather than just swapping resistors i'm using variables so i can set each of the modifications between the normal value and the modded value, should be fun setting it up . I'll have a big black box in the glove compartment with 5-6 dials on it, i've got to cut the APC plug off and extend it at some point so it will reach!

Not sure how much use it will be though now, (thought of it before i set my FMIC up with the tilted radiator) as with my FMIC i can pretty much hit 1.5 bar in any gear .

I may loose a bit of boost though once i've got fueling sorted as the combination of dodgy fuel pump and big IC causes the engine to die at about 3,750rpm, too much air flow, not enough fuel strangles the engine.

I've only just sorted out a space to work on my car again after about 6 months so i've got a massive list of 'thing's to do' built up, i'm hoping by May i'll be sorted and back on the way to 200bhp.

[Tomarse]

sell the red one and use the cash for something good!

If the tuned black box does the same (or a better!) job then keep using that and put the money from selling the red one towards something good! (or tax or insurance)

[Murray]

sounds interesting! i am hoping that i will be over 200bhp very soon(i had a head start with it being a t16s!) might put the money from the red box towards a jt down pipe!

missed your one at coventry! just saw you running as the old bill got involved! lol

[Si]

It was one of 'those days' unfortunately.I'd go with ebaying it, if you're modded one is holding up, keep the 2nd black box as a spare.

[Murray]

Ahhh, alas, 3 apc's 2 cars! once the red goes there will be no spare, i think i will mod the other one too and then tune the pots and see what i can come up with before i sell the red one. last thing i want to do is sell it then need it!

[Saab-Daniel]

Si, something is wrong either mechanically or via the APC, since you get 1.5bar. And deep down, you know it With regards to the apc-issue: Go to www.900aero.com and check out the apc-stuff. In the bottom of the page under the guide to modding the apc, you can see the differences between the red and the black box.
Sell the red one, there is no difference between a modded black one, and a modded red one. Only a difference between a standard black one, and standard red one.
If I where you, I would do the mod I posted way back, making you able to hold boost much stronger in high rpm.
Daniel.

[Si]

Si, something is wrong either mechanically or via the APC, since you get 1.5bar. And deep down, you know it With regards to the apc-issue: Go to www.900aero.com and check out the apc-stuff. In the bottom of the page under the guide to modding the apc, you can see the differences between the red and the black box.
Sell the red one, there is no difference between a modded black one, and a modded red one. Only a difference between a standard black one, and standard red one.
If I where you, I would do the mod I posted way back, making you able to hold boost much stronger in high rpm.
Daniel.__________________

Hi Daniel, yep i know hitting that much boost is'nt right but after reading and reading the APC stuff on 900aero i kinda came to the conclusion that part of the problem is the APC's inherent design, from what i gather it cycles to slow to control boost with my IC, not wanting to 'blow my own trumpet' but my pipework is far shorter and more direct than any of the volvo IC mods and therefore will give alot less lag.

Combination of Bad fueling, very slight lag/fast rise rate and a turbo controller that cannot react quick enough have caused my problems.

As high boost is also a sign of restriction somewhere in the engine, most likley in my case from the engine being strangled by too much air, once i have sorted the fueling issue i imagine that i won't be getting that much boost as the engine revs will increase proportionally therefore drawing air in faster and not causing the 'bottle neck' i currently get when running above base boost.

I'll have the car working properly soon though so will get a much better idea as to whether i need another controller or whether the APC will infact be able to do the job required of it.

[Alex]

Si,

The APC is capable of controlling the boost perfectly adequately if the car is running with a pipe straight from the turbo exit to the throttle body. That is even more direct than even your IC setup.

[Saab-Daniel]

My point exactly Alex, I can't help think there is something wrong...
Daniel.

[Si]

I'm aware of other set-ups with even less lag that why i made the additional comments about the engine rev's not increasing enough to draw air pressure away.

If you got a 2l pop bottle and put a small hole in the end you'd reach the limit of your ability to blow air into it alot quicker than if you cut the end off and tried to do the same, as your cars are properly fuel'ed (and have a better flow capacity due to your extra valves) the APC can do the job that it is intended for, where as with my fueling issues the APC cannot.

I won't know for sure until the cars working properly/properly fuel'd above base boost, just not going to make any assumptions as to how the car will run once it's working properly (also worth looking into alternatives in the mean time).

It's really just my diagnostic from talking to the guy at power engineering, and comparing the video of my car on the rollers compared to the dyno graph produced, and my understanding of how the APC works.

I know i waffle a bit but you only seem to be reading the first paragraph then making conclusions about what i'm saying, if you re read all my posts you'll see i am saying that the APC is/was only part of the problem .