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  #1  
Old 4th October 2011
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Rarelibra Rarelibra is offline
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Default joining the fuel problem club

So only within the last few weeks my 9-5 started showing signs that all indicate the check fuel valve (after searching the forums here).

- weather is getting colder now, I always use 93 octane, and I park on a slight incline driveway

- only when I do a cold start does it offer up any problem, and when it does, it takes a longer time (few cranks) for it to start up and then runs solid

- I tried the advice of turning the ignition on (without starting it) 2 to 3 times to try to prime the pump. When I do this, the back seat area near the fuel pump makes a weird noise almost like a squeaking sound

- no blue smoke visible (only the whitish exhaust normally seen on a cold morning)

- no CEL or battery light, full voltage on the reading

- mpg is solid with no noticeable drop

- FPR is a 3.5-bar, newly installed 6-mo ago when I did the tune

I had been planning to replace the fuel pump with a Walbro 255. From
what I understand, if it is the fuel check valve, any dealer will want to replace the entire fuel line?

Anyone have any thoughts? Appreciate all input.

Thanks!
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  #2  
Old 4th October 2011
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TyrannicalTy95 TyrannicalTy95 is offline
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Have you replaced the fuel filter any time recently?
Have you replaced your plugs any time recently?
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  #3  
Old 4th October 2011
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Rarelibra Rarelibra is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TyrannicalTy95 View Post
Have you replaced the fuel filter any time recently?
Have you replaced your plugs any time recently?
Ah, forgot to mention

- fuel filter replaced only a few months ago (May)

- plugs also replaced at the same time (NGK plugs)
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Old 4th October 2011
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TyrannicalTy95 TyrannicalTy95 is offline
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Ok, well, you can take a quick look around the copper washers by the fuel filter. If there's a small leak, the system could be depressurizing as it sits, requiring you to crank/prime longer. That happened to me immediately after replacement though.

I haven't had to mess with a fuel check valve (yet), but if it's related to grade, you could try backing into your driveway so that you're parked on a decline . Sorry, good luck!
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  #5  
Old 4th October 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TyrannicalTy95 View Post
Ok, well, you can take a quick look around the copper washers by the fuel filter. If there's a small leak, the system could be depressurizing as it sits, requiring you to crank/prime longer. That happened to me immediately after replacement though.

I haven't had to mess with a fuel check valve (yet), but if it's related to grade, you could try backing into your driveway so that you're parked on a decline . Sorry, good luck!
Thanks for the advice - I will put it up on a lift on Friday and see what I find.
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  #6  
Old 5th October 2011
elefante72 elefante72 is offline
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I was having very similar problem. It escalated last week though and had a stall at a stop light. Since I had performed the same maint (and DIC a few months back) the only items remaining that could be an issue was the check valve and the CPS. This time of the year they start changing over gas too, so who knows.

In any case I bashed my knuckles and did the CPS the other day. Starts without hesitation and power is back. I let the car prime for 5 seconds before I start. I did notice there was a little oil near the crankcase by the CPS. In any case the new one is sealed and seems to be working well. The magnet seemed to be much weaker than the new one.

I will report in a few weeks.
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  #7  
Old 5th October 2011
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ScaniaPBman ScaniaPBman is offline
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Default Hard start problems.

Rarelibra,

Have a look through this thread on the Saab 9-3 & GM900 Workshop forum which covers your problem.

ScaniaPBman.
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  #8  
Old 5th October 2011
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Rarelibra Rarelibra is offline
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Rarelibra,

Have a look through this thread on the Saab 9-3 & GM900 Workshop forum which covers your problem.

ScaniaPBman.
Thank you for the input.

Reading through the thread, it seems to denote the problem with the injectors and not the fuel pump/check valve.

I have been wanting to upgrade to a Walbro 255 pump for several months now, so I am contemplating just doing a full replacement of the pump, check valve, and injectors. That should just about do it.

Will give an update after the weekend - we are going to do a wrench turning get-together in the local area here.
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  #9  
Old 5th October 2011
elefante72 elefante72 is offline
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I too was thinking check valve, however after priming a few times in some cases it still wasn't starting easily. I have an 04 also, and be aware the CPS is one of the keys for starting the vehicle (timing fuel injection) also, when I removed my CPS the magnet was weaker and I noticed some wear on the CPS cable that was going around the engine (I think it was the balancer). In any case while I was in there I noticed that the "Silicon mod" that everyone was talking about and I also replaced all those vacuum hoses--after the CPS) (many of them were close to disintegrating)), and the last few days the car is running as smooth as ever.

I wasn't going to prove it was the CPS by putting it on a scope, but the resistance was 830ohm when I tested it out (hot). By bending the cable and banging it (maybe vibration on start) I was able to cause a momentary open (short). I didn't try this with my new one, but it was--to me--evidence enough of an intermittent CPS issue.

So while I did not get a CEL for the CPS, once replaced the cold start problems and smoothness came back. The low idle disappeared (as much as can be in the saab) once I replaced w/ the silicon hoses -- prob not your issue.

This is still not proof that the check valve is still not a problem, but first starts are crisp and clean.

Also, as a precaution I had the battery system checked by the dealer and it was ok too.
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  #10  
Old 5th October 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elefante72 View Post
I too was thinking check valve, however after priming a few times in some cases it still wasn't starting easily. I have an 04 also, and be aware the CPS is one of the keys for starting the vehicle (timing fuel injection) also, when I removed my CPS the magnet was weaker and I noticed some wear on the CPS cable that was going around the engine (I think it was the balancer). In any case while I was in there I noticed that the "Silicon mod" that everyone was talking about and I also replaced all those vacuum hoses--after the CPS) (many of them were close to disintegrating)), and the last few days the car is running as smooth as ever.

I wasn't going to prove it was the CPS by putting it on a scope, but the resistance was 830ohm when I tested it out (hot). By bending the cable and banging it (maybe vibration on start) I was able to cause a momentary open (short). I didn't try this with my new one, but it was--to me--evidence enough of an intermittent CPS issue.

So while I did not get a CEL for the CPS, once replaced the cold start problems and smoothness came back. The low idle disappeared (as much as can be in the saab) once I replaced w/ the silicon hoses -- prob not your issue.

This is still not proof that the check valve is still not a problem, but first starts are crisp and clean.

Also, as a precaution I had the battery system checked by the dealer and it was ok too.
This is great information, elefante.

It is most definitely not the hoses, as I replaced all of my vacuum hoses this summer with silicon (also replaced my turbo and coolant hoses). And I don't have a low idle (nor any sputtering or stalling). And when I go out in the afternoon after it sits in the parking lot all day, it cranks over within a few seconds, no hesitation like in the morning.

I follow the primary problems that we face with this model (CPS, DIC, etc) - so I am hoping it isn't the CPS, though I am prepared to replace it, if need be.

Friday I will have it up on a lift (I have the luck of having access to a place with a lift for on ly $5/hr), and will troubleshoot by checking the battery as well. I have injectors coming overnight that will go in on Saturday (time to upgrade, anyway). And I will pick up and put in a new check valve (they are not expensive - so why not, right?).

If by next week the problem resurfaces after the upgrades/replacements, the only other option would be the CPS - will keep you posted.

Thanks again!
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  #11  
Old 5th October 2011
Jssaab Jssaab is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rarelibra View Post
Thank you for the input.

Reading through the thread, it seems to denote the problem with the injectors and not the fuel pump/check valve.

I have been wanting to upgrade to a Walbro 255 pump for several months now, so I am contemplating just doing a full replacement of the pump, check valve, and injectors. That should just about do it.

Will give an update after the weekend - we are going to do a wrench turning get-together in the local area here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rarelibra View Post
This is great information, elefante.

It is most definitely not the hoses, as I replaced all of my vacuum hoses this summer with silicon (also replaced my turbo and coolant hoses). And I don't have a low idle (nor any sputtering or stalling). And when I go out in the afternoon after it sits in the parking lot all day, it cranks over within a few seconds, no hesitation like in the morning.

I follow the primary problems that we face with this model (CPS, DIC, etc) - so I am hoping it isn't the CPS, though I am prepared to replace it, if need be.

Friday I will have it up on a lift (I have the luck of having access to a place with a lift for on ly $5/hr), and will troubleshoot by checking the battery as well. I have injectors coming overnight that will go in on Saturday (time to upgrade, anyway). And I will pick up and put in a new check valve (they are not expensive - so why not, right?).

If by next week the problem resurfaces after the upgrades/replacements, the only other option would be the CPS - will keep you posted.

Thanks again!
CPS causes start or not when the car is off, sputtering while running ( as the engine tursn it runs past "dead spots"

You definitely have the fuel issue. I replaced my pump wiht the 225 Walbro and the one I used had a check vavle built in Did not work.. changed the chech vavles and still same issue.

I have read there is a software update for hard start when cold that is uspposed ot fix this.
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  #12  
Old 6th October 2011
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Rarelibra Rarelibra is offline
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So I called to get a quote on the check valve... it is listed in on Jim Ellis Saab Parts (part 8977779) for $4 but the dealer says you can only get it with the entire fuel line (sending) - for $124!

I hate capitalism!
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  #13  
Old 6th October 2011
elefante72 elefante72 is offline
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I hope I still dont have a check valve issue . Let me know how long it takes to fix. Its starting to get cold in UNY.... Changing the CPS took me 90 min. Most of the time was spent figuring out how to better wire back to the terminal, and it was def easier to get at it from below how others have suggested.
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