Extra 60 HP anyone? - SaabCentral Forums
*
Home Saab Pictures Saab Classifieds Saab Dealer Listings Saab Forum Saab Forum


Go Back   SaabCentral Forums > Saab 9-3 SportSedan, Cabrio ('04+), Combi & 9-3X, 2003-2012 > 9-3 Sedan, Cabrio ('04+)/Combi & 9-3X Performance Mods & Tuning - ALL ENGINES

9-3 Sedan, Cabrio ('04+)/Combi & 9-3X Performance Mods & Tuning - ALL ENGINES Covers GENERAL Tuning & Performance modifications that are *non-engine specific* in nature

SaabCentral.com is the premier Saab Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 23rd September 2003
sam_jam sam_jam is offline
Active Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003                                                
Location: UAE
Posts: 123
Default Extra 60 HP anyone?

These guys claim they can add 60 Hps to the 93's 1.8t 150 Hp engine ...

http://www.superchips.co.uk

their dealer here says this can be done via upgrading the ECU's software alone... not yet available but coming soon ... is it that simple ? Has anyone used Superchip before? any info on this ?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2  
Old 23rd September 2003
HEF HEF is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2003                                                
Location: Philly, PA
Posts: 179
Default

60 horsies just from engine management? i am skeptical. i think it's very possible if you dump all the cats from the exhaust AND add engine management.

i saw their dyno map, but i'd like to have someone i know dyno the car before and after.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #3  
Old 23rd September 2003
Abbott-9-3 Abbott-9-3 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2003                                                
Location: uk Epsom
Posts: 200
Default

It depends i suppose.You can get piggy back ECUs which do just that,sit on top and take care of all things relating to power,you can have a straight chip swop or a programme remap.Personally,i would trust my car to a tuner who knows the map and will check the car out properly.

The chip is probably nearer 20bhp tbh,although with turboed cars the gains are significantly higher than with n/a
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #4  
Old 23rd September 2003
Kick Kick is offline
New Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003                                                
Posts: 2
Default

The power increase is possible. Hirsch, the 'home tuner' for saab has a chip available that increases 45hp (from 150 to 195) See www.hirsch-perfomance.ch/motor.htm . The chip from superchips claims to increase 61hp. I don't know what's different here. The price info of the chip from Hirsch is not made available but my dealer said to expect 2000 euros.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #5  
Old 23rd September 2003
WASAAB's Avatar
WASAAB WASAAB is offline
Saab Lunatic
 
Join Date: Feb 2003                                                
Location: 03 Launch 93ss [RARE]...@Hawaii.
Posts: 1,402
Default Re: Extra 60 HP anyone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sam_jam
These guys claim they can add 60 Hps to the 93's 1.8t 150 Hp engine ...

http://www.superchips.co.uk

their dealer here says this can be done via upgrading the ECU's software alone... not yet available but coming soon ... is it that simple ? Has anyone used Superchip before? any info on this ?
I'm wondering Is that a Advertising HP up
or
Actual HP up :-??
60 ++ hp from ECU... I doubt it :P
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #6  
Old 24th September 2003
sam_jam sam_jam is offline
Active Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003                                                
Location: UAE
Posts: 123
Default

thanx guys ... things are clearer now ...

Is true that Hirsch tuning will not void the SAAB's warranty ? anyone knows?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #7  
Old 24th September 2003
mikej's Avatar
mikej mikej is offline
Saab Crazy
 
Join Date: Nov 2002                                                
Location: Warwickshire, UK
My Saabs: MY09 93sw TTiD Aero. '66 Healey 3000
Posts: 846
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sam_jam
thanx guys ... things are clearer now ...

Is true that Hirsch tuning will not void the SAAB's warranty ? anyone knows?
In the UK you can buy Hirsch upgrades from your Saab dealer BUT only for the 95.
ECU upgrade for 95 is 280bhp (Aero from 250bhp)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #8  
Old 24th September 2003
Kick Kick is offline
New Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003                                                
Posts: 2
Default

Quote:
Is true that Hirsch tuning will not void the SAAB's warranty ? anyone knows?
Iam told that all parts from Hirsch are installable by (specialized) saab dealers and that you keep your warranty through saab. In the past Hirsch would take over the warrenty but saab and hirsch made some kind of pact so now saab wil provide warranty over the installed hirsch parts.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #9  
Old 24th September 2003
mbodo's Avatar
mbodo mbodo is offline
Saab Lunatic
 
Join Date: Jul 2003                                                
Location: Irvine, CA
My Saabs: 03 9-3SS
Posts: 1,160
Default

with saab seeing red for so many years, it's doubtful that they'll take on any additional liability; especially in the form of extending a warranty to outside tuners.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #10  
Old 25th September 2003
danncas danncas is offline
SaabNut!
 
Join Date: May 2003                                                
Location: Pa USA
My Saabs: 206 93 Combi
Posts: 457
Default chip

Im not sure they rate Hp the same as we do here. In Germany it PS and KW.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #11  
Old 25th September 2003
mbodo's Avatar
mbodo mbodo is offline
Saab Lunatic
 
Join Date: Jul 2003                                                
Location: Irvine, CA
My Saabs: 03 9-3SS
Posts: 1,160
Default Re: chip

Quote:
Originally Posted by danncas
Im not sure they rate Hp the same as we do here. In Germany it PS and KW.
Unless I'm missing something:

PS = Pferdestärken (German: horse power)

do they calculate it differently?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #12  
Old 25th September 2003
murphwiz murphwiz is offline
SaabNut!
 
Join Date: Jun 2002                                                
Location: Herts, UK
Posts: 444
Default

[quote="HEF"]60 horsies just from engine management? i am skeptical. i think it's very possible if you dump all the cats from the exhaust AND add engine management.
[quote]

Not a superchips fan... but..

I've a 9-5, with ecu, and got a cast iron 76bhp horsepower increase, and a useful 111nm of torque extra too.

So yes it is possible with upgraded software, saab has left a lot of tuning potential in the map...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #13  
Old 25th September 2003
HEF HEF is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2003                                                
Location: Philly, PA
Posts: 179
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by murphwiz
Not a superchips fan... but..

I've a 9-5, with ecu, and got a cast iron 76bhp horsepower increase, and a useful 111nm of torque extra too.

So yes it is possible with upgraded software, saab has left a lot of tuning potential in the map...
really!? is that wheel horse power, or crank hp as guesstimated by the retailer? i.e. did you dyno your car?

sorry for the skepticism mate, but i have been tuning cars (mostly wrx's) for 2 years and have never seen any engine management (ecu swap, piggyback chip, or ecu remap) yield much more than 35-40hp. and even those extra ponies are really walking a fine line with high egt's and boost pressure. but i have never touched a saab. i hope my 9-3 has your 9-5's potential!

cheers
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #14  
Old 27th September 2003
sam_jam sam_jam is offline
Active Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003                                                
Location: UAE
Posts: 123
Default

Well HEF ... I think its a great thing you being a car tuner yourself ... but i hope you are wrong about "not much more than 35-40hp" .. I really would love to add those 60hp's on my car ...

I Dont know much about car mechanics, but is'nt the three 93 engines (1.8t 150Hp & 2.0t 175 2.0T 210 hp) all physically the same? it makes some kind of sense to me that SAAB just plays around with ECU power output tunning or whatever technical settings (i know nothin about) and voilla! you get three different Hp engines? does that make any sense? will you hire me at your worksop?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #15  
Old 27th September 2003
WopOnTour's Avatar
WopOnTour WopOnTour is offline
Active Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003                                                
Location: NA
Posts: 103
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sam_jam
I Dont know much about car mechanics, but is'nt the three 93 engines (1.8t 150Hp & 2.0t 175 2.0T 210 hp) all physically the same? it makes some kind of sense to me that SAAB just plays around with ECU power output tunning or whatever technical settings (i know nothin about) and voilla! you get three different Hp engines?
It doesnt quite work that way in this case. There are significant mechanical differences betwen these engines, most notably the camshafts and turbochargers themselves.

While it IS technically possible for recalibration or alterations to ECU software will result in large horsepower gains, it all depends on the engine and various choices made by the manufacturer with respect to things like induction, exhaust, fuel delivery system and injectors etc. Often software is NOT the bottle-neck.

The only reason there are ANY gains available through software is the factory ECU programming has entirely different priorities than your average enthusiast driver.
1. Emissions
2. mpg
3. General Drivability
4. Performance (horsepower, 0-100, etc)

1.Unfortunately for enthusiasts' they can't even bring a car to market that does not meet current emissions regulations (FTP) . Most regulated exhaust emissions are measured in grams of production per mile, therefore larger engines running with A/F ratios necessary to deliver more horsepower produce more emissions. I guess we should be concerned with the quality of the air our great-grand children will breath, so it's a catch-22.

2. Auto manufacturers that sell cars into the North American market must calculate their Corporate Average Fuel Economy (CAFE) and pay a tax to the Feds for every vehicle sold above an established standard. In 1999 auto manufacturers contributed $16 million dollars in penalties to the US Federal Reserve. A very informative web-site on CAFE regulations can be found here:
http://gm.com/company/gmability/publ...ment/cafe_101/

3. How you car operates when NOT under full power is very important to most average consumers. As horsepower goes up the manageability of the engine for conditions such as cold-starting and operation, stop and go traffic, and transitions in throttle request/demand becomes compromised.

If all you care about is WOT, top end, or lowest possible ET, ECU tuning mods can provide various levels of return. However, most become more evident after OTHER modifications such as camshaft grind, exhaust headers or intake/induction and other "flow" improvements.

Be careful what you ask for, you might just get it! But at what cost? (You certainly will give up SOMETHING)

Lot's of outfits make all sorts of claims of "dyno-ed" horsepower via software and while some are legit, MANY are all "smoke and mirrors" with a lot of "fine print" in how those claims have been realized. I currently use a program called LS1edit to make subtle (or drastic) changes in the fuel and timing maps/tables on LS1 equipped Firebirds, Camaros and Corvettes. I WISH a commercial product like this was available for the Bosch/Saab T7 or T8 systems but as far as I have been able to determine there is NONE...yet

Although many tuning companies are claiming ECU mods are "coming soon”, I for one would be suspicious of any that offer a “deal” to become a beta-tester or to purchase the product prior to release.

JMO
WOT
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #16  
Old 27th September 2003
JFK-USAF's Avatar
JFK-USAF JFK-USAF is offline
Saab Crazy
 
Join Date: Feb 2003                                                
Location: Man from the "Right coast" stuck in Cali
Posts: 504
Default

WOT -- Thanks --- Thats great info for those of us that are thinking of boosting their Linears capabilities.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #17  
Old 28th September 2003
sam_jam sam_jam is offline
Active Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003                                                
Location: UAE
Posts: 123
Default

nice ... thanx for the enlightment
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #18  
Old 28th September 2003
Abbott-9-3 Abbott-9-3 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2003                                                
Location: uk Epsom
Posts: 200
Default

yep,in the Impreza world there are well known rolling roads who er,slightly exaggerate the figs and there are those who most would trust to be somewhere near.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #19  
Old 28th September 2003
cactuscool cactuscool is offline
Active Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2003                                                
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 43
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WopOnTour
Although many tuning companies are claiming ECU mods are "coming soon”, I for one would be suspicious of any that offer a “deal” to become a beta-tester or to purchase the product prior to release.

JMO
WOT
A guy I knew a long time ago was part of a testing program and had gotten some FREE mods from HKS to basically turn his '92 Eclipse Turbo into a 500 horsepower monster. 8) It was great until his engine literally exploded.

No beta testing for me.. no sir.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Bookmarks

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the SaabCentral Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:13 AM.



Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

top of page | sitemap | email us



copyright © 2003 - 2011 saabcentral.com, All rights reserved http://www.whiter.co.uk - valid xhtml - valid css
SaabCentral is an independently run website and is not affiliated in any way to Saab Automobile AB.


Garage Plus vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.