Strange goings on !!

[ctrlz]

After reading this forum and speaking to my dealer, I believe i have solved this problem. I also noticed this happening more frequently on hot days.

The problem is the positioning of a sensing stip under the leather seat cover. I've had my seat out and moved it. The strip is located in the mid to back portion of the seat base and runs front to back in the center. It is shaped like a two-pronged fork with the prongs pointing to the rear. It is held in place under the cloth fabric which covers the urethane foam. Small amounts of adhesive hold it in place at the front and rear only. Mine was too far forward. I could tell because, when I pushed lightly on the seam in the mid part of leather cover, the SID warning would come up. I moved the sensing strip rearward by about 1.5" No light without occupants, so far. I have to push much harder on the seam to get it to light now, too.

I can post a more detailed description of how to get the seat out, etc. if anyone is interested.

According to the dealer, Saab initially thought the problem was the leather being too tight. They advised dealers to soften the leather cover with a heat gun, and then have someone lean into it with his knee! This didn't work, BTW.

[Saline]

Seems like maybe they implemented the fix sometime during MY 03 as my May 03 build ARC has not had any false alarms and we have had 90-100+ temps for weeks on end here in CO.

[Viscouse]

ctrlz, great job! Hey, I'll take you up on your offer for directions. I'd love to see how you did it!

[ctrlz]

June 2006 edit:
Read this first. Easier than taking seat apart.
http://www.saabcentral.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=76880

PROBLEM: Passenger seat belt indicator appears in SID when passenger seat is UNOCCUPIED

BACKGROUND: This has been included among the "List of Common Problems" in this forum. An easy fix is obviously to hook up the passenger seat belt when no one is sitting there. I'm not sure, but there may be underlying safety problems related to this fault, and trying such an "easy fix."
There is a sensor array in the bottom seat cushion which detects pressure. This is, at least, part of a Passenger Presence Detection (PPD) system in the 9-3. Because of the shape of this sensor, I suspect it may also be part of an occupant classification system. I don't know how sophisticated the airbag deployment computer is on the 9-3. The most sophisticated systems employ PPD, occupant classification (size, position on seat, weight, child car seat detection), and seat position sensors to help determine the extent of airbag deployment in a crash. If the 9-3 employs such a system, then false readings by the seat sensor could lead to erroneous occupant classification. My dealer tells me there's no TSB on this problem yet. So, I'm posting my solution here.

SOLUTION OVERVIEW: I have a 2003 9-3 Vector with heated seats. Build date 06/03. Your specifics may vary.

You will be taking the lower seat cushion out of the car and repositioning the sensor. My sensor was too far forward. If your warning light is not on all the time, try pushing lightly on the seam which runs side-to-side in the mid portion of the seat cushion. In my car the front tip of the sensor was tucked up almost under that seam, so very light pressure along the back edge of the seam (one finger, gentle push) would give me a warning light. On hot days I'm guessing the urethane foam and leather expand differently, and the warning would come up. With the sensor repositioned, I now have to push firmly with my whole hand or fist to get a warning light. No light on hot days anymore.

WARNING! If you have big hands or forearms, you may run into trouble. You will not be removing the whole seat, just the cushion. There is a lot of reaching into tight spaces under the seat to get the leather cover free. Once the cushion is out, you have to separate the urethane foam from a cloth cover which is glued along the back edge. The sensor strip is glued to the urethane UNDER this cover. You won't be taking off the leather. The sensor is glued at the front and back. The back is easy to free up. But it's a VERY tight squeeze getting your finger tips to the front attachment point (about a 12" reach). This is the part causing the false alarms, so it needs to be pulled out of that tight spot. I have average sized hands and thin forearms. I took my seat into the air-conditioned house to work so my arms wouldn't sweat.

SUPPLIES (other than basic hand tools):

1) double-sided tape - I used foam tape about 1/2" wide. This is to reattach the sensor and close up the seam you'll be opening.
2) plastic cable tie - 1/8" to 3/16" wide, stock is black, but it'll be hidden
3) small penlight - to see under the seat and into the seam once you have the seat off
4) Band-Aids/ paper towels - there are sharp edges on the underside of the seat. As you work, watch out for blood on your nice seats!

TIME: figure about 2 hrs. start-to-finish. I'm gonna tell you where all the clips are. That'll help. ALL of the measurements I give are ESTIMATES, so don’t get out your dial calipers and flame me for inaccuracy!

You'll be changing the seat position several times. The battery saver may kick in while you work. If that happens, close and re-open a door so the seat controls will function. You will not be disconnecting them.

1) Separate trim/control fairing from door side of seat. The fairing is attached in three places. There is a round mounting boss at the front right corner and two metal push clips along the side, one about 5" from the front, the other about 14". Getting these off without damaging the trim is the toughest part. Elevate the seat all the way up with the controls. The front side clip is gold metal and can be visualized and manipulated from under the front of the seat. The rear side clip is identical in type, but can only be felt with your fingertips. The front corner is held in place on the mounting boss with a single spring clip which can be seen when you tug the seat cushion back a little. Pop this off by sliding it sideways with a small screwdriver. You don't have to bend it.
Now the tricky part. If you’re better than I am, you might be able to get the side clips to pop through by working from underneath. They're pretty tight. I ended up pulling out on the front corner while simultaneously pushing on the back of the front side clip with the butt end of a screwdriver. As you get the corner off the boss, the whole fairing comes in one motion.
The seat control cable is attached to the seat frame with one cable tie. Carefully cut the tie (not the wire!) to free up the fairing.
The side clips snap into the inside of the fairing, and hopefully don't shear off too much plastic as you pop this thing off. The plastic may give, and you may have to retrieve the metal snaps from the seat frame. To reattach them to the plastic trim you may need to open up the V-shaped clip to give it more tension. Slide them in sideways rather than snapping from the front. Watch out for small fragments of sheared plastic which might prevent the clip from seating properly. If you can't get it to stay in place, you might try a little silicone to hold it. Otherwise it'll just pop apart when you reassemble. You don't want it to vibrate or feel loose.

2) Detach leather cover from seat frame. Start by releasing two elastic straps which hold the bottom part of the seat back as it wraps under the rear edge of the seat bottom. There are white plastic clips on the end of the straps which clip onto the underside of the seat cushion support. Feel for these and remove. The front and sides of the seat bottom leather cover attach to the seat frame with five long black plastic clips (two sides 6" long, two front corners 2" long, one front center 9"). Start with the front corners. A small flat blade screwdriver may help work these free. Reposition the seat as needed for access. Sitting on it while reaching underneath may give you some slack. Once all five are off, gently work the front right corner of the leather over the mounting boss.

3) The front of the seat should now lift up. The heater cable comes off the front edge. Notice how it is routed through the rectangular hole in the frame. Disconnect the cable, also noticing how it is supported by a clip under the seat in its mid-portion. Now run your hands along the seat frame sides where the cover was clipped on. There are two sawtooth projections which are spaced the exact length of the side clip. The clip locks in between these when you put it back together.
The back of the lower cushion is held with two elastic loops at the rear sides. Notice how they hook around onto the plastic tabs, then reach underneath from the back and release them. Put the seat into full recline for the last part. The back edge of the leather wraps around the back frame and hooks into the cushion support grid in four places. With the cushion elevated, work from the front side to unhook. It’ll still be pretty tight even with the seat back reclined.
Last thing remaining is the sensor wire coming off the back center. Disconnect, and remove the cushion.

4) The urethane cushion needs to be separated from the grey cloth glued along the back edge. Using your fingers work from the center opening for the wire toward the sides. I had to open it up about 8” total to get enough access.

5) Take a look inside with your penlight. The sensor strip is fork shaped with the “handle” to the front and two “prongs” pointing back toward you. The wire attaches to one of the prongs where it is glued at the rear. The front edge is also glued. Separate the back from the foam, then work your fingers way in there to get the front loose. My front edge felt like it was under the seam. I did this part in an air-conditioned room so my arms wouldn’t get sweaty.

6) Pull the whole sensor array back about an inch. Make sure it doesn’t wrinkle or kink as you move it. Once you have it moved back and flattened, plug the seat back into the car and test it. You should only get a warning when significant pressure is applied. If you were having heat related symptoms, you might want to leave it like this for a few days until you’re satisfied you got the sensor positioned where it works correctly.

7) Reattach the back edge of the sensor with double-sided tape. Close off the seam you opened with the tape as well. I didn’t bother trying to tape the front in place.

8) Installation is reverse of removal. The rear elastic loops are snug and barely stretch to get back on. The side clips for the leather cover lock in between those sawtooth projections I mentioned earlier. You may need to sit on the seat as you reinstall to gain slack. Check your driver’s seat while you’re at it. Both side clips were not positioned correctly on mine, and one of the front corners was hanging free. Don’t forget the new cable tie for the seat control wiring. Put the spring clip back on the corner of the trim fairing. Now snap the fairing back on in one coordinated motion. It doesn’t bend very much, so you can’t do it one clip at a time.
Check the fairing to make sure it clipped on OK and you’re finished!

[finwake]

I too get the passenger notice with my briefcase, cd case, you name it. No noise though, just the warning light.

I had a unique occurance where, on a quiet Sunday evening I gently waited to let some cars with elderly drivers slowly cross in front of me, you know, to be a nice gentlemen and -- without even a single hand on the wheel -- my car honked at them. A sharp, loud long one too...

My 86 900 Turbo had some of these friendly little gremlins; looks like I'm in for it again! :wink:

[mbodo]

Originally Posted by finwake

I had a unique occurance where, on a quiet Sunday evening I gently waited to let some cars with elderly drivers slowly cross in front of me, you know, to be a nice gentlemen and -- without even a single hand on the wheel -- my car honked at them. A sharp, loud long one too...

I find myself doing that intentionally .. not to the old folks, but just about everyone else.

[keysman]

Originally Posted by Saline

Seems like maybe they implemented the fix sometime during MY 03 as my May 03 build ARC has not had any false alarms and we have had 90-100+ temps for weeks on end here in CO.

Saline, I don't think it gets hot enough in CO for the issue to come up. I only have the problem here when the temperature is near or above the century mark (100 degrees).

[PeterFilias]

ctrlz, thanks for that very detailed explanation. However, should we have to do stuff like this, or should Saab?

[ctrlz]

Peter,

To each his own. To a certain extent, I'd rather do things myself so I know they're done right. It took me quite a while to figure out how to get that seat out without breaking ANYTHING. Service techs are on a tighter schedule. So, maybe you get one who's never done this job before. There's no Saab tech bulletin yet. So who knows what he'll do. It's pretty much all hidden from view, so you'll just never know.

I also thought this sensor problem was potentially more serious than just causing an annoying light.

And, I didn't want anyone to think that removing the seat was a walk in the park.

ctrlz

[aeromac]

I had the same problem in my 03´93SS Aero.
Considering that the seats are not simple chairs, and being afraid of activating
airbags, or breaking some wires, I left this job to the professionals (one should presume that they are).

I mentioned all the data provided in this forum, regarding the heating activation, etc, and they fixed the problem in 1 hour. No stranges going on from then.

[SteelGrey]

No more strange goings on !! (I hope) - after a hot summer suddenly the weather cooled just when I wanted to demonstrate the problem to the dealer - anyhow they replicated the problem by turning the heater on max and once the cabin was fit to explode the warning came on - only then can the diagnostics find exactly where the faulty seat sensor is - once identified - the new sensor was ordered and fitted and problem over - except that on the way to the dealer on another very cool day and nothing on the seat ....yes the final goodbye appeared on the display ... the 93ss is definitely possessed ! - still hopefully now fully exorcised !!

[cyberkatis]

Thank God I have a vert. Also mine has no Chime...I'm beginning to think it's a blessing.....

Chris.