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NG900 & OG9-3 Performance, Mods & Tuning Covers Tuning & Performance modifications for the NG900 (1994 to 1998) & OG9-3 (1999-2002) & '03 Convertible

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  #1  
Old 30th July 2007
9600 9600 is offline
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Default Installed MBC+A, Still cant adjust boost

I have the MBC+A installed perfectly according to all instructions...and no matter where I adjust the MBC to, the car still boosts into the red and hits fuel cut.

If anything, the fuel cut feels harder...as when it hit in second gear, my tires chirped.

I am at a TOTAL loss....wastegate? What do I do?
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  #2  
Old 30th July 2007
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doorcheese doorcheese is offline
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do you have an aftermarket boost gauge?
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  #3  
Old 30th July 2007
9600 9600 is offline
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I do not have an aftermarket boost gauge.

I called Jeff from Smart Performance and we decided that the wastegate had to be sticking. Either from too much oxidation on the wastegate regulator itself, or a failed wastegate actuator.

Tomorrow morning I'm going to take the heat shield off and see if i cant move the wastegate actuator with my bare hands, if it moves and still doesnt work...then its the actuator. If it doesnt move and is seized all together, then...well...my wastegate is seized shut.

If I can hit it with WD40 and pb blaster and it works.....that would be cool.
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  #4  
Old 30th July 2007
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willsmysticcobra willsmysticcobra is offline
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keep us updated because I may be going through the same problem
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  #5  
Old 30th July 2007
Bummer 9-3 Bummer 9-3 is offline
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does anyone have the instructions on how to hook up the MBC+A from smart performance because me and my buddy hooked it up and it took us a while and we didnt use a log hose and a short one with a vale on top because he had never seen anything like that because he had only used a Turb XS one, the reason i dont have the directions is because i bought it from someone on saablink but i was just wondering if there were pictures or a site i could go to..
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  #6  
Old 30th July 2007
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a boost/vacuum gauge might help you adjust the mbc
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  #7  
Old 30th July 2007
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willsmysticcobra willsmysticcobra is offline
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you need to plug off the old apc and run the line from the t-body hose to the wastegate...
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Old 30th July 2007
Tweek's Turbos Tweek's Turbos is offline
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Compare how you have it set up compared to here:
http://www.lehigh.edu/~cak7/Upgrades/Stage1/MBC.html

I think the actuall case is something isn't hooked into the bpc solenoid correctly and thus you are trying to tune something not actually hooked into something.

Try it like above link, only forgo the anticipator portion.
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  #9  
Old 31st July 2007
9600 9600 is offline
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Theres not much you can do wrong when hooking this thing up. The throttle body line runs to the inlet on the mbc, the other side of which is already routed into the Y connector. The wastegate line is run into the open inlet on the Y connector, and the turbo line is run to the APC. I have the short cable blocking off the wastegate and turbo inlets on the BPC, and have left the intake line hooked up to the BPC.

A stuck WG would explain a lot actually. I've always wondered why my stock T5 ecu boosted well into the red.

Has anyone dealt with a seized wastegate or wastegate actuator before?

Last edited by 9600; 31st July 2007 at 01:49 AM.
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Old 31st July 2007
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Default UPDATE - With Pics

So I think my nightmares have been confirmed. When i removed the heat shield and tried to move the wastegate arm, it wouldnt budge. I can tell its not the fault of the actuator because i can see the arm moving around inside of the diaphragm.

I think my wastegate is stuck closed internally. Im going to keep hitting the actuator arm and joint with WD-40, but i have a feeling its not going to do anything. No matter how much force i placed on the arm, it would not slide to open the wastegate. I didnt try giving it any impact...as I dont want a wastegate thats stuck open either.

Here are some pictures, maybe someone can see something i cant.



The whole assembly



Wastegate side



actuator side.
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  #11  
Old 31st July 2007
markm99 markm99 is offline
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i really think you should take the waste gate off first, then inspect it. sometimes the internal spring makes it hard to move by hand when its installed. it only takes a few minutes to remove. and once you have it off you can connect a vacume hose with a bike pump on the other end and give it a pump. you should see the actuator arm move outward (and stay extended assuming your holding pressure). or you can pull the actuator out by hand, and put your thumb over the nipple; it should stay extended (holding pressure)untill you release you thumb. good luck Mark.
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  #12  
Old 31st July 2007
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Im not quite sure what you mean.

Disconnect the wastegate from the actuator arm and use the bike pump to check to see if the actuator is bad?

It only takes 6psi of pressure to move the wastegate, so hand hand pressure moving the arm should be more then enough to activate the wastegate. The actual switch on the wastegate itself is totally seized...it wont move at all.
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Old 31st July 2007
markm99 markm99 is offline
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what i meant was , completely remove the "wastegate actuator" from the turbo. (it takes 2 bolts, a clip, and a vacume hose.) once the whole thing is removed then test the pressure of the diaphram. i remember that on my garrett turbo it took a fair amount of force to move the rod when it was intalled. i would have to pull it at least a 1/4 inch to the right just to losen the clip for adjustment. it needs to be under some load to hold the wastegate, in the turbo, shut. and when you remove the clip from the wastegate arm(on the turbo) to the actuator(the rod piece), the waste gate should fall free and move easily. if the wastegate itself is actually rusted shut, you will have an easier time breaking it free when its disconnected

Last edited by markm99; 31st July 2007 at 01:24 PM.
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  #14  
Old 31st July 2007
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Do you think its safe to attempt to break the wastegate arm free? I have to make a 500 mile trip this saturday, and im really worried that it would get stuck open if i were to try to mess with it.

Or do you think if it breaks open, ill just be breaking the rust holding it shut and be fine after that...
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  #15  
Old 31st July 2007
markm99 markm99 is offline
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i think its safe if you tap at it and dont try to force it. and a little liquid wrench would help.

all the wastegate is, is a 1 inch rod that connects to the lever that you can see in your second picture. on the other side of the rod there is essentially, an arm connected to a flapper. the rod travels through the turbine housing. its hard for me to imagine where some thing like this could rust solid, and not be tapped loose.

first, i would take the clip off the actuator and then check to see if this lever moves freely. if this shows not to be the problem, then test your actuator.
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  #16  
Old 31st July 2007
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What is the best way to remove the clip from the actuator arm? It doesnt seem to be very accessible from the top of the engine bay, is this something i have to get from down below?
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  #17  
Old 31st July 2007
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SPATL SPATL is offline
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I think what Mark is saying is a good test. if you can disconnect just the arm off of the wastegate lever, you might be able to isolate the problem. This will either eliminate the WGA arm being part of the problem or identify it. If you just disconnect the arm from the WG lever, you should be able to move the arm freely. You can, at that point test the WGA to see if the diaphragm is okay.

As a side observation, the arm and looks nasty so do the test above and then you can move onto the WS lever.

Here is a picture of mine(with a helper spring) with 180K miles on it.

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  #18  
Old 31st July 2007
markm99 markm99 is offline
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just use some needle nose pliers/ baby flat head screw driver. you can get to it from the top.
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  #19  
Old 31st July 2007
9600 9600 is offline
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Im going to let the engine cool down for a few more hours, and then hit it with some PB blaster....hopefully that will make it easy to remove that retention pin and break some of that oxidation off of the arm and lever.
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  #20  
Old 1st August 2007
9600 9600 is offline
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The PB blaster worked!!!!!

No more fuel cuts, full boost!

I guess there was so much surface oxidation on the wastegate/arm/actuator that the whole assembly couldnt move.

Im...so...happy
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