:) Help please- Slave Cylinder price question

[wranderson]

Ok this seems to be the site for me to finally get answers! THANK YOU for being here.

I have a 1992 Saab 900 (non turbo) which has an issue with the slave cylinder. I have it in the shop and they have given me a quote which seems very overpriced! First I'm a woman HOWEVER my step father was a mechanic and as a result I was forced to learn about cars so that I wouldn't be taken advantage of in the real world. I have been able to work on my own American cars in the past and done a FEW (Very few) slight things to the Saab. I live in the US and noticed most people on the forum are from international locations so I've converted dollar questions to euro

The shop gave me a quote of 500-600 USD (375-450 euro) to rebuild the slave cylinder. I was in shock so I quickly looked up the replacement parts and found was about 10 USD (7.5 euro)... that much labor seems unreal!

Also they have been unable to identify a stange sound that I hear when I engage the clutch.. which sounds like a power steering pump which is about to go out and is under stress.

Can anyone please put some light on the subject.. is the rebuild on the slave overpriced???

also any clue on the strange sound?

All help greatly appreciated in advance!

~M~

[grif900]

first of all, welcome to saab central. 600 usd to rebuild the slave is outrageous. who rebuilds a slave cylinder? you put in a new one, and usually replace the pressure plate and clutch disk and the throw-out bearing, and resurface the flywheel(ive been getting away with 80 grit on my random-orbit sander for years). the noise is probably the throw-out bearing.in fact im shure it is. if you cant afford to buy a clutch kit and must replace just the slave and the throwout bearing,think about doing it your self. you will find lots of help here.

[Goge]

Hello ~M~
Well first off, I dunno, that price might not be too far off. Considering:

-Remove clutch/flywheel/slave (takes a while)
-Recondition seals in slave? Or replace with new slave? A seal kit might be $10, if not then a new slave is like $100+ but probably a better option really
-Put everything back together (takes a while...)
-Bleed hydraulics (takes a bit of time too)

I did this all myself, but I put in a new clutch and pressure plate and slave. It took a fair amount of labor time to do all that.

Your noise might be the throwout bearing that sits against the slave, I'm not sure though. Seems like they ought to be able to diagnose a bad throwout bearing.

Sorry I can't offer more help!

-Todd

[Goge]

grif beat me to the post while I was writing. I'm just too slow.

[grif900]

todd-you removed yer flywheel. some times you can only afford to fix whats broken, and the slave and t.o. bearing(along with the clutch) is one of the first steps in doing a total clutch job. an afternoon in the driveway for a d.i.y. person who did their homework first, and had a decent set of tools. for this job there are only three special tools that would be needed,and ive made them myself back in the dark ages.

[TheRedBaron]

That price is very high. Even an incompetent mechanic could do it in well under two hours (let's say $160 to be generous). $100 or so for a new slave kit, (lets say $120 with a seal kit to be generous, plus a 50% parts markup because that's what a lot of mechanics do --> $180). Add those up and it still only costs $340.

They may think you don't know that the clutch on these cars is in "front" of the engine unlike most other cars where you'd have to seperate the engine from the transmission. It is very easy to access (especially since your's is a non-turbo and doesn't have all the extra piping to remove). Either way, if you do it yourself or not, don't bring it back to those guys!

To give you an idea of the work involved to DIY:
http://www.saabcentral.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=14255
http://www.saabcentral.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=35662
http://www.twinsaabs.com/900_repair/...tch_step1.html (ignore the fact that this is a 'performance enhanced' turbo model that he's working on)

bleeding the clutch if it's a problem:
http://www.saabcentral.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=86807

And the parts required:
http://www.eeuroparts.com/searchresu...=1015&cat=1006

[Goge]

Perhaps... maybe Mr. Mesthene remembers the hour allocation for removal of a slave only. Always amazed by his recall, I can't remember what I did last week.

I think I would eat up at least $300 in labor costs just trying to wiggle that stupid clutch cover off. And another $100 getting it back on!

-Todd

[Goge]

I just noticed that the Baron called me incompetent. I guess the shoe fits though, he's right.

[Goge]

No wait, I re-read his post. I'm sub-incompetent.

[TheRedBaron]

Hahaha Maybe she could take the cover off beforehand as "part of the deal" at a saab indipendent mechanic (if they even exist in florida?)

Is it just me or do a lot of general mechanics just see classic saab owners as a bunch of idiots waiting to waste their money...I don't know why. Or maybe they're just afraid to venture into the unknown or have some sort of hatred of all things old and swedish? Remember that guy saab4zeke who went into an autoparts store and the guy told him what sort of trouble he was going to have with the car and told him it needed glowplugs instead of spark plugs? It gets me, it really does.

[wranderson]

well, this place is called THE SAAAB STORE in tampa florida. We have hadd some very questionable dealings already with these guys. So the sound im hearing is the throwout bearing ill bet. And actually we have alredy removed that cover. It sounds like we need to take the bull by the horns and give this a shot ourselves. One of the things that was keeping us from trying is that we were told the clutch can not be removed without a special tool.

[TheRedBaron]

Originally Posted by wranderson

well, this place is called THE SAAAB STORE in tampa florida. We have hadd some very questionable dealings already with these guys. So the sound im hearing is the throwout bearing ill bet. And actually we have alredy removed that cover. It sounds like we need to take the bull by the horns and give this a shot ourselves. One of the things that was keeping us from trying is that we were told the clutch can not be removed without a special tool.

Yeah the only part where it may get tricky is if bleeding the clutch is difficult - you may need to buy a pressure bleeder, or better yet make one yourself that can be used with a bike pump. I'd imagine you could do it using an old bike tire, a spare brake fluid resevoir cap, a slice of plastic and some good epoxy.

Check out the discussion on this page with the diagram that shows one way to go about it:
http://www.saabcentral.com/forums/sh...hlight=bleeder

[grif900]

Originally Posted by wranderson

And actually we have alredy removed that cover. It sounds like we need to take the bull by the horns and give this a shot ourselves. One of the things that was keeping us from trying is that we were told the clutch can not be removed without a special tool.

good on ya ! about the only hard part is the spacer tool. ive used five gallon bucket bales, and all kind of other creative inventions. now i just borrow the spacer fomr the local indi. shop. another useful tool is a shortened allen wrench to remove the seemingly endless slave bolts.

[wranderson]

and a further question. The person at the saaab store says that to get to the slave cylinder, you have to remove most of the clutch. Is this the case or not? does anyone have a specific pic of the slave cylinder location?

[grif900]

yeah- the slave t.o.bearing and clutch all come out in one move. its easy as long as the slave still works enough.

[wranderson]

is the object at the front of the clutch assembly ( it has the bleeder valve on it) the slave cylinder? i can not beleive how wonderful you guys are being. im getting that warm fuzzy feeling i can not thank you all enough. HEY- how much should a small shop charge for a full clutch job?

[grif900]

Originally Posted by wranderson

is the object at the front of the clutch assembly ( it has the bleeder valve on it) the slave cylinder?

yup. red seems to have the price list sussed. so add 2- 3 hours labor=the total cost of a decent clutch job.add the cost of a pilot bearing and another hour or so to pull the flywheel properly resurface it and replace the bearing. and youve got the number for a first rate clutch job.

[wranderson]

well then that sorts it, i will be picking it up tomorrow, driving her home and we will order the parts and give it a go ourslves. Do you gents recommend one service manual over another or do you think the pics on here will be all we need?
And a little more info, it bleeds out easy enough, it loses clutch when it sits for more then a week or so. We just didnt realize that where we were bleeding it was actually the slave cylinder.

[TheRedBaron]

Originally Posted by wranderson

is the object at the front of the clutch assembly ( it has the bleeder valve on it) the slave cylinder? i can not beleive how wonderful you guys are being. im getting that warm fuzzy feeling i can not thank you all enough. HEY- how much should a small shop charge for a full clutch job?

Yes, that's the one. If you look in this picture, you can see it all:
You have the flywheel on the bottom of the screwdriver (in relation to the picture), the pressure plate bolted to it, the clutch friction disk in the middle, the release bearing is the small bit b/w the slave and pres. plate, and the slave is at the 'top' of the picture with the nipple.

Well a complete clutch kit for your car with a slave from eeuro should cost $230, and using that "estimate" of two hours at $80/hour (which is a high but common price around here in this somewhat inflated market) I'd say around $400. But most places will want to order the parts themselves (and probably wont get as good a deal as at eeuro which I linked to earlier) and then mark them up. A markup is a normal thing for most mechanics, they need to make a living too. If you find a genuine kind of guy who's having a good day and you walk in with a clutch kit he may just charge a reasonable labor fee. If they know saabs they'll know that even two hours is a lot of time to get it done, especially considering the unit is already exposed (you mentioned you removed the cover). But some guys really will try to screw you, sadly it might be worse for you being a woman, they'll figure you don't know your stuff (as you may have already experienced).

[TheRedBaron]

Originally Posted by wranderson

Do you gents recommend one service manual over another

If you get a manual, get the Bentley 16v service manual, it's very good and will probably help you down the line as well. But for this job, you will probably be fine just on this site, there is a lot of info on clutch jobs here that you can search for.