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a little T5 love

94K views 297 replies 48 participants last post by  99'9-3 
#1 · (Edited)
a little T5 love NOW WITH BIN DUMPS

http://www.alldatasheet.com/datasheet-pdf/pdf/MOTOROLA/MC68332ACFC16.html

the data sheet for your processor.

on the board just below the processor there's a spot for a 4 pin (serial/rs2332) connector.

i will post more when i find more out... im at work and only had a chance to open the case. i havent played with the ecu at all yet.

im hoping there is someone else out there thats all about open source...
 
#52 · (Edited)
zer0daze said:
i am going to bump this. now that i have pissed a couple people off, maybe when they are laying out in the sun throwing the ball for the dog, they will be reading a book about assembly, or maybe C+ so they can write a front end.

if only there were more asian guys interested in saabs. they would have just changed a tire and the ecu would have been disassembled... crazy asians
Ummm...my take-away from this post is that Asians are more ECU savvy than non-Asians, and people who don't know assembly language, or who don't care to learn, are lazy....

Is that an accurate assessment?
 
#53 ·
mike saunders said:
Ummm...my take-away from this post is that Asians are more ECU savvy than non-Asians, and people who don't know assembly language, or who don't care to learn, are lazy....

Is that an accurate assessment?
Somewhat mike...
then again how many ECU's come with serial connection right on board???
not too many i can think off, thats why ppl who are really serious about performance switch to standalone because of the tunning costs.
if everytime you made a major change to your setup you need to re-program your ECM, and if its like saabs where there's limited aftermarket the market that specializes in it takes advantage and will rob you blind !!

IF zer0daze does manage to sort this out (and im sure he will) how many on here are willing to try and tune their own cars ?
im sure a small percentage will say no due to the fact that they will be afraid to mess with settings but the majority will try to twek or mess with them to try and get all they can out of the factory ECM just like Nordi, maptun and the other tuners do for free !!!

and im sure that no one can beat free!
 
#54 ·
Problem is he's about two years too late for me and some other folks. There's nothing more to be done....

Maybe some of the new guys might want to chance it...
 
#55 ·
mike saunders said:
Problem is he's about two years too late for me and some other folks. There's nothing more to be done....

Maybe some of the new guys might want to chance it...
I might....

I might get someone who does a lot of standalone management tuning to have a looky.....

I might win the lottery and have the whole car Air freighted over to Nordic and give them carte blanche....

but I digress
 
#56 ·
huh?

Saying asians will probably understand how this ECU works is rediculous and a bit naive. I would say that Europeans probably understand it best since they have been using this ECU for a while. The US made Moto 68332 is very old and runs at 16 Mhz (read sssllloooowww). Most x86 computers today are running at 3 Ghz!. One possible reason it has two flash parts is one contains i-stream (instructions) and the other is d-stream (the maps used for proper settings based on inputs (sensors in the car)).

All ECU boards have serial ports on them. Usually the serial port consists of 2 stake pins for transmit and receive as a console to the processor. In order to reverse engineer this to make your car go faster, you will have to not only modify the actual maps (ie a matrix table that reads input stimulus and locates the proper outputs [boost, fuel, air, etc], but you will have to understand the algortihms used with the matrix table data. You will also have to fully understand the 68332 output ports and what the ranges are. I paid good money to have my ECU (stage 3+) done by Nordic where they have been doing it for years and are still making enhancements. Sorry to be a wet blanket, but ppl who take the time to figure all this out (can take years), usually make a career out of it for a reason...

-greenhobby
 
#57 ·
greenhobby said:
Saying asians will probably understand how this ECU works is rediculous and a bit naive. I would say that Europeans probably understand it best since they have been using this ECU for a while. The US made Moto 68332 is very old and runs at 16 Mhz (read sssllloooowww). Most x86 computers today are running at 3 Ghz!. One possible reason it has two flash parts is one contains i-stream (instructions) and the other is d-stream (the maps used for proper settings based on inputs (sensors in the car)).

All ECU boards have serial ports on them. Usually the serial port consists of 2 stake pins for transmit and receive as a console to the processor. In order to reverse engineer this to make your car go faster, you will have to not only modify the actual maps (ie a matrix table that reads input stimulus and locates the proper outputs [boost, fuel, air, etc], but you will have to understand the algortihms used with the matrix table data. You will also have to fully understand the 68332 output ports and what the ranges are. I paid good money to have my ECU (stage 3+) done by Nordic where they have been doing it for years and are still making enhancements. Sorry to be a wet blanket, but ppl who take the time to figure all this out (can take years), usually make a career out of it for a reason...

-greenhobby
the asians thing was a joke.
as for the negtivity towards doing it, dont post it here. pgmfi.org an openecu.org prove most of your post wrong.
hobbiest do it. i worked on the honda stuff for 3 years, then i made a career out of it, i no longer liked it. i sold my car and the majorty of my business and bought a saab, thinking i wouldnt mod it. 2 weeks later i had a 2nd ecu with the chips off the board and the code disassembled. why? for some strange reason i enjoy it more when im not getting paid to do it.

oh, and mike... the only people that i would call lazy are the ones that will complain about the costs and then not do anything about it. that crap drives me nuts... i see it all day long from the sales staff at work.
 
#58 ·
zer0daze said:
oh, and mike... the only people that i would call lazy are the ones that will complain about the costs and then not do anything about it. that crap drives me nuts... i see it all day long from the sales staff at work.
That's a valid point.
 
#60 ·
"pgmfi.org an openecu.org prove most of your post wrong."

Which part of my post was wrong? The 16 MHz part? The slow speed part? The serial port part? The flash part? The mods require understanding of the maps and algortihms part? The 68332 has programmable ranged output ports? The part where people get paid for their knowledgable mods to the ECU? Exactly which part was wrong? You've been a software engineer for how long? You need a website to prove me wrong? I didn't say don't do it. I said to get it right, you'd better know what your doing. If your cranking your engine up to 6K with full boost on the highway, you better have those maps complete. My note is intended to be a caution to those that think this is easy and jump in but are unaware of the dangers (NOT to crap on your posts and just be negative). That said, by all means tinker away...

-greenhobby
 
#61 ·
perhaps i misunderstood (i took it as you saying it cant be done). its not an easy task by any means. i read honda code until my eyes bled, and then read some more. but i am sure there are new users that will come on and see this. i would prefer that they be encouraged to think outside of the box.
 
#63 ·
zer0daze said:
perhaps i misunderstood (i took it as you saying it cant be done). its not an easy task by any means. i read honda code until my eyes bled, and then read some more. but i am sure there are new users that will come on and see this. i would prefer that they be encouraged to think outside of the box.
Yea, I want a be out a tha box:p I would love to read some code and know how to get into the ecu and look around and reverse engineer it. I wish I knew where to connect up to the eprom?

John
 
#64 ·
So it seems to a bystander that an in circuit emulator would be the thing.
It would require a little wiring change to the board. Considering how old the technology is, you should be able to find a 68K version cheap.
Set it to interrupt on memory reads or better yet on certain address ranges, like the prom/data area, find what it does with the data, use it or store it. On stores set more interrupts on access to those locations. Then you'll know what opcodes access the data. Disassemble that code.
The bottom line = use as many tools as possible, look at opcodes starting at known relevant locations.
 
#65 ·
a project for one of you that wants to help

we need to follow the input traces. ie. map sensor, iat, bla bla bla.

i should have a good dasm posted of the executable sections up soon.

next will be working on the checksum. may be better to just buy it (i know another tuner did)
unless someone here knows eric law and knows if he made any progress with it.
 
#66 ·
i asked a couple people and they are looking in to it, but it probably doesnt hurt to post it up here.

i can get a ng900 ecu cheap, and i want to desolder my chips take dumps and compare them to the 9000 t-5 ecu dumps i have.

the issue.

will the ng900 ecu run the car with the newer alarm?
i have read that there was just a jumper used on the older cars to by pass it. can the old ecu be used with the jumper so i can take my ecu apart and dump it?
 
#69 ·
I should be getting my reprogrammed ecu within the next few days. I can desolder the chips and take them to work and try to read the values and compare it to my stock ecu. I know the machine we have at work works for any vw/audi chip up to 2004, so i imagine i will be able to read the chip. Just out of curiosity, which chips should i be desoldering to check? Once i get them both out I can compare them. So which one (or ones) should i put into the programmer?
 
#71 ·
Hrmm....this weekend might warrant a trip to the junkyard to pick up a spare T5 ecu.

I'm gonna link this up with some of the guys over at MegaSquirt....they are wizards with Motorola hardware/programming.

What jobs still remain on the table or need help with completion?
 
#72 ·
8valvegrowl said:
Hrmm....this weekend might warrant a trip to the junkyard to pick up a spare T5 ecu.

I'm gonna link this up with some of the guys over at MegaSquirt....they are wizards with Motorola hardware/programming.

What jobs still remain on the table or need help with completion?
it would be nice to see a dump direct from the ecu.

with the bins disassembled the biggest hurtle right now is the checksum
 
#73 ·
heres the pin locations needed to hook up the hardware posted above. the only one i didnt follow was the BKPT/DSCLK. i assume it runs on the bottom of the board, but its tough for me to follow it just via pics.




pins 3 and 5 for the berg port are only grounds. you should be able to hook them up anywhere.

its really nice to see people taking interest. hopefully we can really get this project off the ground.
 
#74 ·
I think its really nice that you are sharing this information so that some of us that have the interest and desire to play around, may be able to do exactly that, I would love to be able to check out a stock ecu and my modded ecu just to see what kind of changes have been made with the ignition, boost and fuel maps... Cool stuff. If there was a way to tie into the ecu with a laptop and make changes on the fly, that would really be awesome. I want to run 18psi while I drive around town. I am going to the track to try and put down some decent times, I want my boost up to 25psi... That would be awesome, John
 
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