another td04 question [Archive] - SaabCentral Forums

: another td04 question


jonny72888
29th January 2007, 05:36 PM
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Mitsubishi-TD04HL-16T-Turbocharger-Turbolader-1-bar_W0QQitemZ320024825978QQihZ011QQcategoryZ33742Q QrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem
this turbo would work right? (replace a t25)
it says the wg is set a 1 bar so would that be where the base boost would be?

lms
29th January 2007, 05:41 PM
Shipping would kill you I think since it's coming from japan?

jonny72888
29th January 2007, 06:12 PM
i know, im not planning on that one but that type. so it would work?

mike saunders
29th January 2007, 08:27 PM
This is where I bought my first 16T, but it had a Volvo compressor housing. The unit was new, as advertised, and in GREAT shape.

That seller is first rate. I'd buy from him again without hesitation...

jonny72888
29th January 2007, 08:43 PM
This is where I bought my first 16T, but it had a Volvo compressor housing. The unit was new, as advertised, and in GREAT shape.

That seller is first rate. I'd buy from him again without hesitation...
you first... what happen to it??

how long did you have to wait?

mike saunders
29th January 2007, 08:47 PM
you first... what happen to it??

how long did you have to wait?


I sold it a year or so ago. It worked great, but I went bigger....

This one is different than the one I had in a couple of ways: It doesn't have the stupid Volvo compressor housing, so you can fit it without removing your AC; and the exhaust housing is a standard five bolt, so you can use a five-bolt to V-band adapter at ATP Turbo...

It's also about $60 more than I paid, but it's worth it...


Shipping was about 10 days or so...

jonny72888
29th January 2007, 08:49 PM
so what would i need to bolt this one up?
oil/water lines
intake
what else?

mike saunders
29th January 2007, 08:53 PM
so what would i need to bolt this one up?
oil/water lines
intake
what else?


Lines, intake (which you can fab up), the 5-bolt to V-band adapter, and you might need to shorten your DP slightly and weld on a V-band


Also....this turbo would convert to 18T for not much dough....

G96nt
29th January 2007, 08:54 PM
I'm going to have to call chinese knock-off here.
I've NEVER seen a MHI turbo without the diamonds on it.

However, if mike's going to say he's purchased from this guy, and the turbo held-up, I'd Consider it.

mike saunders
29th January 2007, 09:07 PM
I'm going to have to call chinese knock-off here.
I've NEVER seen a MHI turbo without the diamonds on it.

However, if mike's going to say he's purchased from this guy, and the turbo held-up, I'd Consider it.

Good eyes!

I didn't see them on the compressor housing either, but the diamond star is cast into the exhaust housing in one of the pics.

I had no idea who MWM is, but apparently they make turbodiesel engines for various manufacturers and source their turbos from Mitsu....

Boostd GVR4
29th January 2007, 09:33 PM
How different is the Mitsu 16g from a 16t? I know a lot about the G series mitsu turbos, but not much about the T. I assume the flange for the exh. mani is completly different?

G96nt
29th January 2007, 09:52 PM
I'm not sure 100%, but I know most "G" series MHI turbos are dual-veined.
This one looked single. the 14b is single-veined as well. the "t" may only have to do with the garrett-like exhaust-side.
but the 13g, 16g, 18g, and 20g are all dual, and MHI-standard hot/cold sides.

69mgb
29th January 2007, 10:07 PM
I might be mistaken, but i dont see any water lines to cool the turbo... I think there are more than just the vane types that make up the differences between the "g" and the "t" turbos.


Mark

DFroelich
29th January 2007, 10:21 PM
You can get the bolt up Saab TD04s for half that price, and rebuild them to an 18t and save money. Why get that one?

jonny72888
29th January 2007, 10:40 PM
You can get the bolt up Saab TD04s for half that price, and rebuild them to an 18t and save money. Why get that one?
i cant find any saab turbos... thats my first choice

mike saunders
29th January 2007, 11:05 PM
New Saab TD04s are closer to $600-700+...

Used junkyard ones are $300-350, but it's a crapshoot whether you have to rebuild the turbo anyway....

jonny72888
29th January 2007, 11:12 PM
New Saab TD04s are closer to $600-700+...

Used junkyard ones are $300-350, but it's a crapshoot whether you have to rebuild the turbo anyway....
i would want to rebuild it just to be safe

DFroelich
29th January 2007, 11:56 PM
car-part.com (www.car-part.com)
Its got plenty of both the 5 and 6cm^2 versions from 200-400. Some have even been rebuilt.

mike saunders
30th January 2007, 12:00 AM
car-part.com (http://www.car-part.com)
Its got plenty of both the 5 and 6cm^2 versions from 200-400. Some have even been rebuilt.


Problem is some shops will list rhe Garrett turbos too....


EDIT...just checked...

Of the first 10 listed nationally, eight are definitely wrong (Garrett and not Mitsubishi), one is right, and one is potentially right....

Troll_speed
30th January 2007, 12:09 AM
I'm not sure 100%, but I know most "G" series MHI turbos are dual-veined.
This one looked single. the 14b is single-veined as well. the "t" may only have to do with the garrett-like exhaust-side.
but the 13g, 16g, 18g, and 20g are all dual, and MHI-standard hot/cold sides.

Sorry to jack but...

Can you elaborate?

I bought a 16g to fit on my car from someone on another Forum...

G96nt
30th January 2007, 01:55 AM
elaborate how?

if you look @ the inducer of a 13g, 15g, 16g or whatever other "g" series turbo MHI makes it's got a dual-blade impellar. staggered, actually.

while the 14b and other turbos are single. let me see if I can find a picture....

here's a 14b inducer
http://myspace-991.vo.llnwd.net/00215/19/95/215975991_l.jpg
let me try again



here's a 16g inducer


http://www.roadraceengineering.com/parts/turbos/16g-big16g.jpg

Troll_speed
30th January 2007, 09:54 PM
16t vs 16g?

Boostd GVR4
31st January 2007, 12:00 PM
right the G series turbos are all double vaned. But you cant just bolt on a 14b or 16g to our saab manifolds? can you???

G96nt
31st January 2007, 12:35 PM
nope

t-series(mitsu) turbos use a t25 exhaust housing (not the same as DSM t25's, which are made by garrett) , and have a different bolt-pattern.

I *AM* working with a friend that has a shop in FL and access to iron-casting
to see if we could have a 9000 or 9-3 manifold re-cast with a mitsu flange on it.
we'll consider it a pipe-dream for right now, But it would be the BEST option for upgradability.
I'd gladly pay $400-$500 for a cast manifold and another $600 for a EvoIII
and maybe another $200 for lines to have an off-the-shelf 44lb turbo

it's WAY better than a disco-potato or whatever they call the gt28rrrrrrrrrr

John Z Williams
31st January 2007, 01:05 PM
I will take you with my gt3071:cheesy:

G96nt
31st January 2007, 01:29 PM
yeah yeah yeah... my point...

There's a plethora of turbo upgrades with mitsubishi flanges.
there's not so many with the t25 flange. and it costs WAY too much to upgrade to a standard t3 flange.
Not to mention the $1200 jak wants for his manifold or $1700 maptun wants.

why not pay $500 for an upgraded cast manifold that will HAPPILY flow 500HP worth of air? Slowboyracing sells/sold an aftermarket re-cast of an Evolution manifold for $300 that had been cast From a ported, and smoothed manifold. it's able to handle, easily, more than 450HP. (figure, a FP red and/or green)

There's not really a NEED for these big, extravagant, manifolds.
the vendors would love you to believe there is. and the only reason...?

$$$

Ryan33
31st January 2007, 01:54 PM
im actually talking to a guy from connecticut who does custom manifolds with either a t25, or t3 flange and he does them for about $400...option of internal or external wastegate...i was thinking about jak's manifold for a while but for the price it's just not worth it at all...and yes i have the gt28rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr and it was pain in the balls to make work (fit) had to use a spacer, if you could make a cast to fit a mitsu housing we could all have a field day with turbo's to run as well as alot of saabs with sneaky petes under the hood :o !!!! lol!

John Z Williams
31st January 2007, 02:25 PM
I agree with you guys about the manifolds, I wish there was a supplier for our saabs that would make a decent tubular manifold for a decent price. 1000-1700 bucks is a whole lot of money for the manifold, that is a new gt30:o

I understand the time that these manifolds take to fab up and that is what the problem is in my opinion, the guys have to spend a good 6-8 hours making one and if they want 50-100 bucks an hour, well there is your 500-800 bucks in labor right there and if you want a nice burns collector and all that, its another 400 bucks in parts alone. 400 bucks plus the 500-800 bucks in labor and there you have it, 1100-1200 bucks just to make it worth the guys time to fab one up for someone.

I wish there were more options and if someone could come up with a decent cast manifold or something for 400-600 bucks, I bet they would sell like hot cakes! If anyone does find a decent on for a decent price, like Ryan, let us know about it and maybe more of us will go this route. I would love to try a nice tubular manifold, but until I can make my own or find one for under 700 bucks, I will continue to hold out.

Nick did do some testing on this matter and he feels the stock ng900 and the stock 9000 manifolds are not that restrictive, its the relocation for better inlet pipe that is important and then of course the swap to t3 flange or external waste-gate is also another reason people switch manifolds.

John

Ryan33
31st January 2007, 02:56 PM
Yea John, i am going to be talking to this guy alot more about it, becuase if he do it for a decent price im sure i can bring him alot of business for these manifolds seeing how they would work for both the 9-3's and 9000's...i will keep you guys posted!

Troll_speed
31st January 2007, 06:58 PM
I bought a TDO4HL-15G made buy Mitsu and it has a Saab plate on it. It's from an Aero, got it from Snow4_1Man

You're making me doubt it's going to fit

nope

t-series(mitsu) turbos use a t25 exhaust housing (not the same as DSM t25's, which are made by garrett) , and have a different bolt-pattern.

I *AM* working with a friend that has a shop in FL and access to iron-casting
to see if we could have a 9000 or 9-3 manifold re-cast with a mitsu flange on it.
we'll consider it a pipe-dream for right now, But it would be the BEST option for upgradability.
I'd gladly pay $400-$500 for a cast manifold and another $600 for a EvoIII
and maybe another $200 for lines to have an off-the-shelf 44lb turbo

it's WAY better than a disco-potato or whatever they call the gt28rrrrrrrrrr

G96nt
1st February 2007, 09:04 AM
If it came off an aero... it's going to fit ;)
There are 15g's that Come off the 3000GT, as well, though.
and a 13g that comes on 90-94 automatic turbo DSM's

paintballpimp765
1st February 2007, 10:12 AM
what about a td04-H t25/T28 Turbo with a t/25 flange? would that work

if not what turbo besides the t25 will be direct fit/little mod needed to fit?

G96nt
1st February 2007, 11:13 AM
there's no such thing as a tdo4 t25 as far as I know.
t25's are garrett, and tdo4 is MHI

paintballpimp765
1st February 2007, 12:04 PM
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Mitsubishi-Turbocharger-Turbo-TD04-12T-TD04-LIKE-NEW_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33742QQihZ018QQitem Z280075446623QQrdZ1

would that work with minor mods?

this is the t25 tdo4 i was talking about

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/T25-T28-TD04-H-TURBO-CHARGER-INTERNAL-WASTEGATE-8-PSI_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33742QQihZ002QQitem Z120081160825QQrdZ1

G96nt
1st February 2007, 12:41 PM
both of those appear to have standard t3 flanges.
you'd have to measure-out the bolt-hole spacing to know.

I'm not going to pretend I know much about saab Turbo interchangability. (did I make a new word?)


sorry I can't be of more assistance.

on the OTHER side.
a t12 is a small turbo. probably smaller than an OEM standard t25 or aero turbo.

These people should be able to show/tell you airmass capabilities.

I, personally wouldn't buy an upgraded turbo that's not capable of at least 35 lb/min.

when I spoke to forced-performance, they said they could get 36 lb/min from a 6cm td04-into-18t hybrid thing.

But, it was $750 not-including core.

Troll_speed
1st February 2007, 01:01 PM
there's no such thing as a tdo4 t25 as far as I know.
t25's are garrett, and tdo4 is MHI

FYI

MHI= Mitsubishi Heavy Industries

G96nt
1st February 2007, 01:12 PM
I know.... :)

Which is why it's weird to see a tdo4/t25 on the same turbo.

Just have 'em measure the bolt-spacing, And you'll know if it fits.
Just like the old 9000's had a "t3" but it had bolt-spacing of it's own nature.

Troll_speed
1st February 2007, 02:11 PM
I know.... :)

Which is why it's weird to see a tdo4/t25 on the same turbo.

Just have 'em measure the bolt-spacing, And you'll know if it fits.
Just like the old 9000's had a "t3" but it had bolt-spacing of it's own nature.

Meant more for P-Ball, soorry;)

2ksaabturbo
1st February 2007, 03:47 PM
this is the t25 tdo4 i was talking about

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/T25-T28-TD04-H-TURBO-CHARGER-INTERNAL-WASTEGATE-8-PSI_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33742QQihZ002QQitem Z120081160825QQrdZ1

It's a Td04 with a T25/28 flange. Yes it could be made to work but the turbo inlet would need to be fabbed to fit and an adapter would be needed to fit to your current downpipe or just have your downpipe modified.
Might need to be clocked too. Not worth the work IMHO.

nutzy
1st February 2007, 07:26 PM
Mmmm, how do you say "cheap and nasty Chinese knock off"?:nono;

Don't walk, RUN!:o

That thing has a T25 flange on it. Comp cover is circlipped to backing plate meaning it is a little T25 diffuser, not TO4B.

Pete