GM removing SAAB from product line??? [Archive] - SaabCentral Forums

: GM removing SAAB from product line???


mav238
13th January 2005, 02:40 PM
Can anyone confirm this news I heard about SAAB? Due to poor sales in 9-2X?

Rob in Atlanta
13th January 2005, 02:47 PM
That would be earthshaking news. There hasn't even been a hint of such news to my knowledge. There has been some speculation, but no hints or news of such things. Where did you hear the news?

mav238
13th January 2005, 03:23 PM
That would be earthshaking news. There hasn't even been a hint of such news to my knowledge. There has been some speculation, but no hints or news of such things. Where did you hear the news?

Well, a friend of mine who knew I was driving a SAAB, told me that heard on the radio news that GM is seriously looking at dropping the entire SAAB line, due to poor 9-2X sales, and also not too impressive sales numbers for the 9-3 and 9-5.

apzer09
13th January 2005, 03:28 PM
GM is evaluating the case for keeping Saab running. Closing is a possibility, but it's not likely, since they're still planning where to build the next-gen 9-3.

Viscouse
13th January 2005, 03:29 PM
I'm going to put this in the News Forum.

PunktKruger
13th January 2005, 04:34 PM
Sounds like they're gearing up to me:

http://www.granturismox.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=7288

http://www.saabcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=41785

TuuSaR
13th January 2005, 05:25 PM
That granturixmos link is not worth reading for. So much false information and ignorance.

Overall GM doing "bad cop, good cop" talk is nothing new. We have seen it before. Sadly it always causes a lot of confusion among some people.

Remember few years back the "all Saab engineers were fired" thing that was held as real information when it clearly was not....
Same rumor avalanche will start again and people will ask:
"oh, can I still order a Saab do they still make them?"

Calm down.

valbowski1980
15th January 2005, 06:14 PM
I hope someone good buys SAAB on the cheap and fixes the mess GM has made (ok, didn't fix).

PunktKruger
18th January 2005, 02:21 PM
That granturixmos link is not worth reading for. So much false information and ignorance.
How do you figure?

apzer09
18th January 2005, 06:32 PM
If GM closes Saab, then it doesn't make much sense for them to start rebadging the 9-3 as a Cadillac in Europe does it?

Closing Saab isn't the first thing GM wants to do. If they eventually decide to do it, it probably won't happen before the end of the decade. Saab is an important asset, especially in Europe, since Cadillac hasn't had much success.

apzer09
18th January 2005, 06:33 PM
How do you figure?

That article was on like Financial Times or something.

Zaphod Beeblebrox
19th January 2005, 07:03 AM
If GM closes Saab, then it doesn't make much sense for them to start rebadging the 9-3 as a Cadillac in Europe does it? No, but since at the moment, GM is legally commited to buying out FIAT autos, by the end of January 2005, it could well be marketed as such in Europe.

PunktKruger
19th January 2005, 12:27 PM
That article was on like Financial Times or something.
How is that "false information and ignorance"? Most of those guys at GTX are huge car nuts, a few of them huge Saab guys. I'd hardly call the information in that thread "false information" or anywhere near "ignorance", especially when a lot of it is simply discussion and opinion.

No worse than this place.

SaabKen
19th January 2005, 01:21 PM
If GM closes Saab, then it doesn't make much sense for them to start rebadging the 9-3 as a Cadillac in Europe does it?

Closing Saab isn't the first thing GM wants to do. If they eventually decide to do it, it probably won't happen before the end of the decade. Saab is an important asset, especially in Europe, since Cadillac hasn't had much success.


See the thread next door:

http://www.saabcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42303

Rob in Atlanta
19th January 2005, 04:08 PM
No, but since at the moment, GM is legally commited to buying out FIAT autos, by the end of January 2005, it could well be marketed as such in Europe.

Actually there is a significant legal issue as to whether GM is bound to complete the FIAT purchase. I do not know the choice of law provisions in the agreement, but there is a general legal maxim - Pacta Sunt Servanda, Rebus sic Stantibus - Agreements will be observed so long as the conditions under which they were made remain the same. The idea probably has some foundation in both Michigan law and Italian law, the two likely sources of applicable law. FIAT has made a number of enormous changes to the situation since the signing of the deal, including radical refinancing of debt and retirement obligations. I'm not saying that it is a "slam dunk" case, but there is an argument to be made that there has been such a cardinal change as to make the contract susceptible to recision. These ambiguous situations normally lead to negotiated settlements. I understand that both GM and FIAT are, in fact, discussing a negotiated settlement.

braisim
20th January 2005, 04:19 AM
Here is the original article from the Financial Times:

GM review poses a threat to Saab
By James Mackintosh in Detroit
Published: January 11 2005 02:00 | Last updated: January 11 2005 02:00
http://news.ft.com/c.gif A General Motors review of its Saab subsidiary could lead to the upmarket car brand being axed, if the heavy investment required to revive it is deemed unjustified.

GM executives and people familiar with the study said there was only an outside chance that the Swedish marque would be killed off by the review, due to be completed within three months.

But even a remote threat is likely to prompt a political storm in Sweden, where the motor industry is an important employer.

Göran Persson, prime minister, has already visited GM's European headquarters in Zurich to offer local investment if Saab's Trollhättan factory is given more production.

GM added two new models to the Saab line-up last year to improve sales. But Rick Wagoner, GM chairman and chief executive, admitted that the 9-2X small Saab, based on a car from its Subaru Japanese affiliate, had not met sales targets after a botched US launch.

John Devine, GM's chief financial officer, said in an interview yesterday that the Saab brand "still has attraction".

GM insiders said the company is unsure what the Saab brand stands for. The typical customer is an academic - and, says one executive, "the question is, are there enough university professors to make the investments worthwhile?"

Saab has lost money in nine of the past 10 years and GM has steadily reduced its autonomy over the last 18 months. Manufacturing, engineering and most design decisions are now controlled by GM Europe executives, in Germany or Switzerland, reducing local management control to branding and marketing.

bkrell
20th January 2005, 01:38 PM
Look at it this way, they are really cheap right now! Witness the 9-2x Aero that the salesman practically begged me to buy. I agree with some of the previous observations that GM needs SAAB in Europe. I also think they realize that they need a Euro brand here in America. The 9-3 is a great car and I think advertising is its only problem.

Of course, a new Viggen would help!

Architosh
3rd February 2005, 02:08 PM
I hope someone good buys SAAB on the cheap and fixes the mess GM has made (ok, didn't fix).

I agree. I vote for Ford to buy Saab. They clearly have the ability to handle an european brand and a Swedish brand as evidenced by Volvo and what they are doing with using Volvo Architecture platforms on Ford cars too -- not the other way around like GM and Saab.

Hmmm, should I put the non-premium brand in the premium brand car or put the premium brand in the non-premium brand car? Where should I invest my money? Why GM is so ***-backwards in their thinking is beyond me.

ToplessRO
3rd February 2005, 02:57 PM
GM insiders said the company is unsure what the Saab brand stands for. The typical customer is an academic - and, says one executive, "the question is, are there enough university professors to make the investments worthwhile?"

I have to believe they have a better demographic than that but for my .02 when I was car searching for a convertible my thinking was;
Sebring- I am 10 years too young for it
Sypder- I am 10 years too old for it
Solara- I am too hip for it
SLK- sighhhhhhhhhhhh Im too poor for it.

SO-- that left the 9-3- and so far- day 5 I am happy with the choice.

Andy B
6th February 2005, 08:21 PM
I have heard rumors from a norwegan friend, that it said on a swedish website that GM was "considering" moving Saab production from Trollhaten to Germany, to save money, however it said nothing about selling up.

woywitka
12th February 2005, 06:59 PM
it wouldn't surprise me if SAAB was gone in 15 years! The company has little life left, the whole idea behind saab was to be very different! rememebr front wheel drive, headlight wipers, heated seats, then the turbo (WHICH SAID TURBO ALL OVER THE CAR AND PEOPLE LOVED THAT!) the quarky unique style of the 99 led way to an equally apealing 900. Then a nice number of specialty models came in. in my OPINION think the 9000 was the start of more traditional car that looked like all the other cars! the 900 convertable in my OPINION is prob the best looking car this planet has ever seen! before i even knew the name for the classic 900 convertable i was obsessed with them, the rare time i saw one as a kid i wanted to look inside so bad! this is what saab needs, people who know nothing of the company to be drawn to the orignal design! if saab wants any chance to get back in the game they need to revert back to the time of the 900! or if they really feel smart, throw it all away and start with the basics!