I took in my '91 9000 for it's dealer 60K mile service and got a clean bill of health - no problems found. The car has been perfect since I got it. Now it overheats.

Symptoms:

Obviously the temperature on the guage goes to red. The fan wasn't turning on. I checked the fuses and the 30A under the hood was toasted. New fuse - fan on - temp down, but very little before the fan shuts off. It cycles and eventually the fuse blows again. Made for a horrible (and short) weekend trip.

Now I would suspect the temp switch on the fan, but even at highway speeds the temp doesn't go below 3/4 to the red zone, so then I'm thinking the thermostat is going.

Given this - 1) What might be the problem and, 2) how do I approach the guys at the Saab dealer? I don't want to pick up this tab as it was clearly their doing IMO.

Thanks in advance

first.... bring it to yor old mechanic For an Estimate.. then have the Work done Somewhere ELSE...

with all the scams these days of people damaging Cars for Repeat business... seems a LITTLE shady to me..

if it's overheating On the highway Something's VERY wrong...

even a busted Thermostat will run "normal" temps at highway speeds.


do yourself a Favor, and inspect the wores From the switch,a dn SEnsor back as far As you can, and look for frays, splits, or Cracks...

I thought of the scam thing, but I took it to a brand new Saab dealer. I don't think scams are in their best interests. As for checking the wiring, I have. It all looks new, so I'm perplexed.

I'm taking the car back in first thing Monday morning (hence the "urgent", so aside from possibly nailing down what the problem is in advance, I'd also like to know the best tact to take with a dealer when I go in. Maybe someone knows the right angle to take with them.

i've always been a Fan of "it worked FINE when I brough it in...

dependingon the work they did.. it could be an un-plugged Sensor..
or air in the Cooling system

if there's not Enough coolant, or a arge-enough air-bubble near the coolant Temp sensors, the sensors rever will read The Correct Temp. they'll be Reading the temp of The air, and not the coolant/water...which is a HUGE difference...

other Than that.. i dont' know Saabs Well-enough yet....
if it were a mitsubishi...I'd be your man!

Thanks for the info. I figured air in the system but it didn't expalin why the fan was blowing its fuse. Maybe it was just on for too long it tripped. It could be the temp was fine but reading worng. I hope that's all it is.

SOLUTION:

It was a bad hi/lo fan speed resistor. The fan was only kicking in on high, after the temps were hitting the red zone. It was also blowing the fuse.

How much did you pay/did it cost?

The resistor (at the dealer) is US$160-$170, but the parts counter guy told me he'd cut me a break. I'll let you know the final outcome tomorrow after I pick up. I suspect he'll throw in labor (one hour minimum @ $90/hr for a 5 minute job).

Well I just wondered because I added one to my cooling fan at the weekend and bought it from an electronics website in the UK.

Cost £4.54 I'll let you convert that more precisely to just under $8

David.

The part you are referring to is a different part. This is part #4395034. Even on eeuroparts.com it's US$158 OEM. As I suspected, no charge for the labor.

I don't do aftermarket unless the part is harmless, minimally inconvenient when it fails or are performance parts not available from Saab; then I go for quality over price.

Yep, that's on SERIOUSLY overpriced resistor. Mine is a 100W 0.22 ohm resistor. It's a much higher power version that the one supplied by Saab.

I'd place a high bet that Saab manufacture absolutely zero resistors leaving that to the electronic component suppliers.

Saab can then whack on $150 for holding one in stock with a couple of bits of wire on the end and two connectors.

:)

I don't know anything about substituting electronics from a local electronics place. All I know is it's for a two speed fan and my reliably cheaper online store wasn't any cheaper.

djtaylor - if you found a cheap alternative you should post it's specifications so people can locate it in the future if they want to go that route, plus the installation procedure. That is unless "100W .22 ohm" is enough info.

Anyway, done deal. Thanks for the help everyone.

Sure, I thought I already had somewhere on this site?

http://www.nodomainname.co.uk/Saab/resistordata.pdf
I can't like directly to the component on the site I bought from because you have to login first (free registration) but it's www.rswww.com and part number 188-059

Serious F***-off resistor! :)

You can go even higher wattage than that one if necessary but I don't think it would be necessary. If the fuse is rated at 30A then clearly the current would be lower, say 20A max? Then the power dissipated by the resistor would be 88W. I suspect the current is far far less than that in practice.

David.

Hi, David.

This looks like exactly what I need to fix my broken resistor. (It burned up recently.)

I'd certainly rather just change this, if it's cheaper, as opposed to buying the $150 apparatus.

Two questions: Are you sure then that that specific part will work on a 2 speed Saab? (Mines a 93 9000 CSE Turbo.)

Second -- Do you have any advice on how to replace the old transistor with the new one? Is it tricky at all? Is it just a matter of connecting the wires to the screws?

Thanks in advance.

Wolverine, the resistor is just a passive component, as long as it meets or exceeds the required rating then it will be fine.

My reason for fitment is because I have a rather bodged aircon and needed to bring in the fan but at a lower speed than full. A/C and fan at the same time, which is how mine is wired (not my original doing) can stall the engine with too much load.

I have a single speed fan but the only thing that differentiates this from the 2 speed fan is three components, the temperature switch on the radiator, the resistor and the relay. I added these to add my own 2 speed fan but with the slow speed being brought in by the aircon compressor circuit.

Very easy to fit, just drill off the pop rivet that you'll already have then either unbolt the old connectors or solder them with a large soldering iron. Since I don't have an old Saab one, I can't tell you how they should fit but unless someone can tell me otherwise, I am supremely confident that a 100W 0.22R resistor will be fine.

I do have a degree in electronic engineering which just about qualifies me to fit a resistor! ;-)

David.

Thanks, David -- I'll look into this possibility.

Does the UK online store deliver to the U.S.? Do you know of any such stores located here? Thanks again.

If you go to the home page of www.rswww.com, you'll be able
to search for a US supplier.

This is the one that popped up when i followed the link.

http://www.alliedelec.com/

I did have a quick look and they do supply some of the Arcol HS100 range so have a look.

David.

Thanks again, David.

How well does the soldering need to be done? I've never done that before. What would happen if you just wrapped the wires to the connectors and duct-taped it? Would the car explode?

If you haven't soldered before, it's not that difficult, you'll want at least a 25W iron to get it done properly and some multicore solder. Just wrap the wire around the pins first. Tin the iron with a little solder then heat the joint and apply solder from the opposite side.

Don't try to wipe molten solder onto the joint, don't move the joint until the solder has solidified. Just ensure that you heat the joint and then the solder will flow when you add it. A good joint will be smooth and shiny. Dull and pointy joints are the bad ones.

Don't be afraid of the solder bit, it's not hard at all. The problem if you just wrap wire around is that it might move and come off. You'd be better using crimp connections if that's something you're more comfortable with.

David.

Thanks again, David. I think I may give it a go.

Is there any risk of short-circuit or anything if I do the wiring myself, either way? Do these connections need to insulated somehow after I connect them, either through crimping or soldering?

any Chance you could link me to where you got the Resistor (state-side?)

I'm in need of one...and $10 is MUCH cheaper than stealership

G96nt, try following the US link from www.rswww.com though a phone call may help in the end. As I'm not in the US, I haven't trawled for US suppliers but they shouldn't be hard to find, they're just standard big aluminium headsink shrouded 100W resistors.

wolverine, as far as blowing things up, two things will happen, if the fan side of your wiring comes loose, the low speed fan operation won't work. If the other side of the connection comes loose, that'll be 12V live from the battery through the relay so you want to avoid that one coming loose or you could end up with a short.

As far as the resistor bit goes, think of it as just a kinked water pipe, there's NOTHING bad that you can do in manual handling of a resistor like this that will bite you, other than snap it in half and trust me, you won't snap these puppies! :)

If you guys get really really stuck and don't mind a little wait. I can buy these and post them to you if you want to cover my purchase and postage costs. I can take Paypal if that helps but the £ <-> $ exchange rate sucks for you guys right now. :)

David.

I don't know anything about substituting electronics from a local electronics place. All I know is it's for a two speed fan and my reliably cheaper online store wasn't any cheaper.

djtaylor - if you found a cheap alternative you should post it's specifications so people can locate it in the future if they want to go that route, plus the installation procedure. That is unless "100W .22 ohm" is enough info.

Anyway, done deal. Thanks for the help everyone.

I found a nice clip-in resistor on-line.... is 60A Sufficient?
they have .2Ohm, and .25ohm. with only 1% tolerance!
I think .25ohm is best(lower voltage is better Than higher, I'd say?)

anyways... sound good/bad?

Well, being slightly picky, it's not the amps that count but the power that the resistor will need to dissipate.

The 0.25R resistor will dissipate more heat that then 0.2R one because there will be a larger voltage drop across it.

Power is equal to the current squared x R

What's the power rating of the resistor you have found?

Either way, if they reckon you can push 60 amps through it, that would make it 900W which is a bit like a one bar electric fire element! :)

Post a link if you can.

David.

sorry
I mis-typed
it was 60W
not 60A

60A is like 4 gauge wire =0/

Well that's why I was thinking that a 900W resistor would be on the larger size than average!

60W might be tight. To be honest, I haven't measured the current draw from the fan but made my judgement from the fuse rating which is 30A. My judgement was that 30A would allow for surge and so even if the constant current was 20A (which I doubt), then the power dissipated would be 68W.

If the current draw is 15A then it's 56W for your 0.25R choice and 45W for the 0.2R one.

However, mounted in the airflow you could probably be just fine. Can you measure the current draw from the fan, if not, I'll give it a whiz if I get time over the next couple of days.

I can say that the Saab one likely isn't 100W like mine but maybe 75W or 60W. I say that because mine is slightly larger form factor than the mounting holes provided.

David.

Okay -- I've finally ordered the resistor, and I'll let you know how the attachment goes.

I went through allied, and found one ARCOL resistor noted as 100 W, 22 Ohms. This was the Arcol Part # HS100-22F, under Allied Stock # 795-0516.

It's described as a Resistor, Chassis, Mount, Wirewound, 1%, 100 Watts, 22 Ohms.

It's different from the one JTaylor described because it's 1%, not 5%, but hopefully that won't matter.

Here's the link:

http://www.alliedelec.com/cart/partlookup.asp

(You may need to register before you can acces specific pages.)

The cost was $14.95, but there's a $25.00 minimum, so the difference was charged as handling. Not sure about shipping cost yet. Either way, it should be cheaper (and easier) than changing the entire apparatus. The apparatus costs $150, and attachment to the motor seems tricky.

P.S.: How much does it matter how and where the resistor is mounted? Does the resistor act as a thermostat, and therefore need to be placed right behind the fan?

I'm wondering if I can avoid having to drill out the old resistor, and maybe just attach the new resistor behind or above the old resistor (at least temporarily).

Umm wolverine, that should be 0.22 ohms NOT 22 ohms!

Your 22 ohm resistor could end up dissipating much more heat than the other one and you could well find that the fan speed is far too low.

Being 1% tolerance won't matter but it's the wrong value for a direct substitute.

The reason it's mounted in the airflow is to aid cooling, remember this thing (the correct value) is dissipating 50W maybe more so the extra fan cooling is a good thing. It doesn't perform any thermostat function.

Drilling out the old one shouldn't present much of a problem for you, you could hacksaw off most of it if you wanted to but drilling would probably be easier.

David.

As I said, i can post you one from the UK if you get really stuck.

D*mn. There was only one resistor with the number "22" in the Ohms description, so I assumed that was it.

As far as the Arcol HS100 range on the allied site, the closest resistor in terms of Ohms is a 1.0 Ohm resitor.

I wouldn't ask you to post one from England. However, if you come across a U.S. site that has the proper resistor, I'd certainly appreciate the info.

P.S.: There was also a 50 Watt, .22 Ohm Arcol resistor (HS50 series). Would that do the trick?

Edit: From what you're saying above, it seems like it would be pretty borderline.

PPS: G96NT -- could you post the link to that site, and if possible, the resistor? Thanks.

The 50W one might be borderline, as I have said all along, without actually measuring the current draw I can't say, it could be ok. Worst thing that can happen is it will burn out open circuit and not work and you've spent a few dollars, nothing else bad is going to happen as a result (unless it catches something flammable and sets fire to the car (unlikely)).

I'd bet that the fan doesn't continually draw 15A in which case it should be ok.

if you can't find A single .22Ohm resistor, try finding two
.5Ohm resistors, and running Them in paralell.
or, or course, four 1Ohm Resistors.
or three .75Ohm...


If you do this, you will likely need some heat-sink, and to do it away From the fan Shroud(extended Wiring).. as 4 50W resistors is about the size of a 35mm film canister...

I'll try to find that resistor I had found, but it *WILL* Require heat-sink... It's more of a power-supply resistor
I think it said 30*C constant Temp.
which is not All that hot =0/


I'll look when work slows a bit....

this thread was beaten to death, but I just ordered 6 25W .68 ohm resistors from unicorn electronics.

I'll be building a 3-resistor "pack" equalling 22.6ohm, and a rating of 75W.

I will also have a spare if anyone's interested in not having to solder the pack together.
also, unicorn has a high shipping/handling fee, so I figure this helps someone save on shipping/handling($12s/h fee!)

once I get them in, I'll solder up the two bunches, and sell the "spare" for $10(shipped) if anyone's interested.

let me know if you're interested!

Craig R.

Craig is that a typo? The Saab resistor is 0.22 R, not 22 R

David.

yeah.. I realized that After, and Didn't bother fixing it...

the result will be .226Ohm...

want one? =0]

Nah, read back through the thread, I'm running a 100W 0.22R one already. :)

Sorry for dragging this old thread up again found it through a search), but I have a problem with a 9k aero, MY94 but from 1993. Could a blown resistor cause for the fan not starting at all? We haven't had the car all up into the red to see if the second speed should kick in, didn't have the nerve for that :o
After turning the car off, I measured the connection to the blower, which didn't read anything on my voltmeter, eventhough the temps was high enough to tricker the blower. So the low-speed didn't kick in, and didn't test the high speed, but there wasn't any relay in the high-speed socket nor the fuse-holder, which we then applied to no avail...
Any one have any idea? I will be looking into a corroded wire under the radiator, but the rad is all new and the wires look solid, a closer inspection wont hurt...
Where does the before mentioned resistor sit? Inside the radiator?

Please, any ideas would be greatly appreciated...
Daniel.

I had a similar problem with my 1989 9000 last summer...without the fuses blowing. I did two things by accident that cleared up the problem. The car always ran hot since it was delivered, numerous dealers and mechanics said it was just one of those things and the cost of the cure was worse than the problem. The original owner replaced the entire fan system and thermostat without notable success and warned me about the high temp 'ideosyncracy' when I got the car.
Last summer one of the hoses blew during, so I replaced it. Then I accidently overfilled the coolant tank and turned the heater to full blast to get coolant flow throughout the system. After a day or so the coolant level sank to its normal level and the car no longer runs hot! My guess is there was either a restriction in the hose or an airpocket in the heater core or the engine block. My limited experience with SAAB hoses is that they are junk and aftermarkets from the local auto parts store are vastly superior in flow and wear, not to mention price. Look at the simple things first.

Well the car only runs hot when you don't drive it and just let it idle! Otherwise, there is no problem! So the problem is the fan doesn't start, not a general cooling-issue...
Daniel.

Hi all,

I am also in the "Hot" camp with no fan... I am trying to figure out what exact part I can buy;

djtaylor
What exact model resistor did you use? Looking at the data sheet you provided (http://www.nodomainname.co.uk/Saab/resistordata.pdf); I see HS series resistors like: HS10, HS15, HS20 and so on... You mentioned that you used 100W 0.22 ohm . Does this mean that you are using a HS100?

When I muck around on the UK site I can find an HS100 series @ an R22 value with the stock # you listed (188-059); is this the correct one?

Here is what I assume (I know the pitfalls of AssUMe-ing) to be the same thing found at a North American supplier;

----------------------------
http://www.mouser.com
----------------------------
Mouser Part #: 284-HS100-0.22

Mfr. Part #: HS100 0R22 5%

Mfr.: Arcol

Description: Arcol 100W Aluminum Housed Resistors

ALUM HS 100W 0.22 5% - RoHS COMPLIANT per producer documentation

Category: Wire Wound Resistors - Aluminum Housed
---------------------------------------


Please tell me I'm right!!!

______________________________
edit;
I was not able to find the part at the North American site that you suggested, they only have them in the U.K., if I were to order I would have to order a minimum of 30!! :o
______________________________________

Same power rating, same parameters, same housing, same description etc. I'd go with that one.

David.

I just got the replacement resistor in the mail today. I have not installed it yet, (I am waiting for more parts; Thermostat, Thermostatic Contact switch and a couple of washers for the tranny lines that go into the new rad that I installed to start this all) but my first impressions are that the resistor is bigger than the stock one although it looks like the holes line up with the OEM one.

I will update how everything installs once it's done.

Yes I suspect that the original might be something like a 60W or 75W version but there's absolutely nothing wrong with a beefier resistor.

Just make sure you use a highly capable soldering iron because you're going to have to use some chunky copper wire and the combination of that and the size of the resistor contact will mean that even a 40W iron won't do the job.

David.