Traffic ticket etiquette [Archive] - SaabCentral Forums

: Traffic ticket etiquette


Crevalle
30-04-04, 06:43 PM
Ok, I would just like to know the rules regarding what I can, and cannot say, to a cop after he issues me a ticket. In other words, is there some type of legality governing the "etiquette" after a ticket has been handed over to you? In case you haven't picked-up on it, I'm not happy. I was just given $410 in fines last night alone.

This is a legal question. I'm not supporting a police riot, I would just like to know if a police officer can do more to you (after you get the ticket) based on something you say to him/her.

DeLorean
30-04-04, 06:50 PM
not to my knowledge. They can write you as many tickets as he or she likes if he "has you" on those violations regardless of what you say. by law, he can't just make up random things you didn't do and cite you for that. maybe it would help if we had a little more information? how did the traffic stop go? what were the offence(s)?

Willy Wonka
30-04-04, 07:45 PM
I find it's better if one keeps both hands visible at all times. It tends to lower the level of anxiety. If at the drivers seat, I keep one one the wheel the other on the seat back. If else where either the dash or the seat back. A friend who's a statey says that it's safer that way.
Say what you will, but be prepared to hear it back, in court.

D. Wolfe
30-04-04, 11:22 PM
Common sense and etiquette dictate that you show respect to the officer(no arguing or snide comments), keep hands on wheel and tell the officer if you have to move your hands to reach drivers licence and registration. I suppose that, if aggitated, the officer could "find" additional violations and probably kick the crap out of you if he really felt like it. But I believe that most officers are simply upholding the law and want to make their encounter with a violator as brief and painless as possible.

Just remember, do you have the balls to approach total strangers in their car both day and night to do your job without fear? All for the grand total of less than most fast food managers make?

Give respect to the police and 99.9% of them will reciprocate.

squishmann
30-04-04, 11:55 PM
i say #$^% the police.

just joking. 50% of the cops out there are Okay. the other 50 are jerkoffs.


have the interior lights on and tell them when your about to move. that way you don't get shot 44 times

lionsgraphics
01-05-04, 12:51 AM
lol @ get shot 44 times.

Anyway i'm bored, so here's a nice story that happened to my friend ( i was in the passenger seat ).

i remember my friend tinted his windows and because of it he couldn't open his windows for five days. So on 4th day he gets pulled over. He sees the cop is coming closer to his door, and he opens it. Cop jumped back and put his hand on his gun. My friend said in a very calm tone, sorry sir my windows just been tinted therefore i can't open just my windows. So cop calmed down and asked for registration and ins.. What was funny is that he didn't check the tint (it was a lil' lower than legal %.

Anyway when cop said that he was goin' too fast and started talking about a ticket, my friend didn't say a thing. Once cop started walking to his car to write a ticket, my friend said to cop that, it sucks, cause he never received a ticket, then asked i guess warning is out of the question ?

Cop said that, well let me see (that was very surprising).
After, what seemed like an hour (it was like 5 mins), he came with a warning (he was goin' like 11mph faster than limit).


Now about "etiquette"
All i can say is that you shouldn't take things personally, cause man is just doin' his job, and his job is safety of the roads. So just being nice to them like to any other stranger would be just fine.

Umm Crevale go to the court. $410 is a lot, i guarantee you they'll drop some of it, if not all.


mod edit: languge inappropriate to this site

Crevalle
01-05-04, 01:08 AM
Well, I guess I feel fairly betrayed by the very officers I used to stand up for. In other words, I was always the guy who rolled his eyes at those who called cops "pigs" and so forth. I've never been in trouble with the law, and I'm a straight-shooter. But, despite that, I've been getting absolutely nailed by cops over the past year. It's interesting that Minneapolis is in the middle of a large budget deficit. It's not a coincidence. My father's best friend is a police officer, and he said that they are not given "quotas," because that is illegal. They are told, in a round-about way, that the department needs more revenue. Cops, in my eyes, are simply revenue collectors for the state government.

Anyhow, to explain what happened: I was pulled-over and given a ticket for 1.) speeding 2.) no complete stop at a stop sign 3.) no proof of insurance. I asked the officer if I could check the trunk for my insurance card, and he said no, because he already wrote the ticket. I mentioned that I would really appreciate it if I could, because I would have difficulty going down to the police station during the work week to prove I had insurance. He said, "Listen, I'm not going to stand here and argue with you."

Firstly, I was in a 30mph zone, clocked at 38. Big deal. I did not come to a complete stop, but pretty stinking close. I don't stop, count to ten, and then go. I stop the way all of you most likely do. I mean, who actually comes to an absolute complete stop when no one else is at the intersection? Honestly. I think police officers should spend more time catching true criminals than "worrying about my safety" which is a load. If cops truly cared about my safety, why do they need to hide at speedtraps, etc? If they really cared about our safety, they would park in full view of everyone, acting as a true deterrent to unsafe driving/speeding. That is just my opinion, and keep in mind, I am still very angry.

sethsev7n
01-05-04, 01:18 AM
woah man, $410 dollars is nuts.. you better go to court to fight that.. i have an interesting story realy quick.. i was pulled over for an illegal u-turn once.. i got a warning for that but $530 in fines for not having my license or any papers on me at all :o . I found them in the back of my car 30 minutes later and was able to clear everything.. that was a bit scary.

Ive gotten pulled over 5 times.. 4 for speeding.. and only once i got a ticket (it was on a highway with a california highway patrol man..ick). Usually if you are completely honest and apologetic they'll let you off.

M4Gunner
01-05-04, 02:10 AM
heres what you do. if you feel you HAVE to insult the guy, make sure you say "i think" before you do it. that way, your just using your 1st ammendment!

DeLorean
01-05-04, 09:31 AM
I feel bad for you Crevalle, it sounds like you just got "one of the bad ones"... they are out there, not much you can do but fight the tickets. a tip! when you get your court date, go change the date as soon as you get it. that way the cop won't show up because the court date won't fit into his schedule anywhere. can't tell you how many times this one has worked for me... :oops:

PaulH
01-05-04, 10:15 AM
Ok i feel that after my 6 tickets i should be able to add some insight to this conversation, first and foremost always be as polite as possible to the police officer, as lionsgraphics said, theyre just doing thier job and if you are reasonable with them, they will recipriocate. Second ALWAYS go to court to fight the ticket. 99% of the time you will talk to the officer and he or she will reduce the ticket substantially. Also theres a good possiblity that the cop may not show up at all, especially if you reschedule like DeLorean said. And also if they ask if you know why they pulled you over, never, ever tell them why you think they pulled you over, because that may not be the reason!

Now a quick story, last night i got pulled over, 65 in a 45, and i didnt get a ticket. How you ask? well first off I was polite as always, and second of all, I was in my dads car (9000cs) and he has a base sticker in his car because he is in the Air National Gaurd. The cop saw it and asked whos it was, i said my dad, and he said to slow down and gave my license and reg. back to me! he didnt even run my license! that was it. i was amazed, it was a good night.

Paul

Crevalle
01-05-04, 10:59 AM
Are there bumper stickers that are available for those who contribute to police functions, or are police supporters? Of course, I'd hate to put a bumper sticker on my Saab.

Here's something somewhat related, and pretty intersting: the same friend of my father's (who is a cop of 25 years) said that cops have a "code" between each other when it comes to parking tickets. This guy can park anywhere he wants (most notably downtown), and will never receive a ticket. Why, you ask? Because cops leave empty pads (the ones they write traffic tickets out of) on their dash when they park their car. The traffic cops see this, and ignore the vehicle. This is how cops can avoid giving each other tickets. I've been trying to get one of those pads for years.

D. Wolfe
01-05-04, 01:10 PM
Yea, you feel betrayed and you are still angry...... :o

But, you were speeding, didn't stop, and no proof of insurance....and you got caught :nono;

In a nutshell...you are guilty of the three offenses :idea

I would certaintly argue that $410 is a very high fine, and you would be wise to take an attorney with you to argue the fine amount.....or simply pay the amount and learn from the experience :idea

DeLorean
01-05-04, 05:34 PM
D. Wolfe, it really annoys me when you give out the bad advice of "just pay the ticket" this is the absolute worse thing you can do. Even if you take it to court, and flat out lose the case, you can't be assessed more fines. the tickets already include "court costs" and by law these can not be re-applied. you pay court costs no matter if you set foot in the court room or not, so you may as well go to court for the ticket and try to get it reduced. I can tell you this.. If I had just paid every ticket I ever got, I would surely have no license now.

D. Wolfe
01-05-04, 06:22 PM
Two of my greatest joys in life are:

1. Giving out bad advice :roll:
2. Annoying DeLorean :wink:

I believe that I was clear that fighting the amount of the fine would be in his best interest. I have yet to see anyone wiggle their way out of a ticket while in court unless the officer does not show..then it's an automatic free walk.

If you are experienced and versed at getting out of tickets, then you should offer some advice as to how to accomplish this.

(my last speeding ticket was ten years ago in Chicago(Cook County)...I was given the opportunity to have the ticket erased from my driving record in 90 days if I pled guilty and paid the fine--"Guilty, Your Honor"

I cannot speak for your state DeLorean, but in Illinois and Indiana, you are given the choice of pleding guilty or not guilty. If you plead guilty, the whole issue is immediately set as a court trial(before a judge and sometimes a jury).
There is no negotiation with the court at your hearing and no opportunity to argue your belief of whether or not the charges were fair or correct.

DeLorean
01-05-04, 06:43 PM
even the cases I have lost (I have lost 2), one because I was running really late and it was over before I made it in time, and the other because the judge was bad and in a "I don't want to hear it" type of mood. even that one STILL reduced the ticket (a 110+ mph violation! :o) to a 20mph over the limit violation. The ones where the cop does not show, like we all know, instant win. also, to get a jury trial in PA you need to do something really bad traffic wise. not even a drunk driving case gets you that. also, Annoying DeLorean is a sport some at SC seem to like to play! I don't mind it so much ;) if you plead guilty here in PA, there are no benefits what so ever. all you get is increased insurance rates, a nice fine, and points on your license. even if you are found flat out guilty, you can try hard luck cases as to why you can't take the points. Doing this can easily save yourself $1000 in insurance over the 3 years those points would stick on your insurance record. I am not a lawyer by any means, but if you can talk to one who's worked on cases with that judge in that area before, you would be in 3X better shape for the court date. you would know what the judge will and won't go for. this is all assuming you are un lucky, have not changed the court date, and the cop shows up. I meanů there are so many loop holes, it's like a fish net and if you are the smart minnow, you can swim right through one of them.

D. Wolfe
01-05-04, 06:50 PM
Well put DeLorean....I guess each state does have those loopholes to swim thru and you have been pretty successful in finding them.

Like you, the insurance rates and points off your license would concern me the most. Especially if you are a young driver. Everyone speeds,....it takes some luck not to get caught!!!






(annoying you comes from my paternal instinct to voice my years of experience(old guys think they know it all :cheesy: )

squishmann
01-05-04, 06:50 PM
fight the man

i have a court date for 6-18-04

i'm going to change it two weeks ahead of time and have it pushed back another month or two; this way the cop will never show

cops supply a major source of income for local governments

Crevalle, i've received that same B.S. ticket before nobody stops at a stop sign completely. every now and then you get that one person who does, and they're usually lost and are trying to read the street signs.

i guarantee you that if cops where in plain sight on the highways there would be a lot less aggressive drivers. but that would mean less money for the man.

fabric
01-05-04, 07:01 PM
Crevalle- you should attempt to get to court. If you have proof that you were in fact insured at the time you were pulled over, they will dismiss that.

I don't know about the other two, but maybe you'll luck out on the cop not showing. But you will at least take care of the one ticket.

I would be mad about the cop not letting you look for insurance, that would have taken you what, 2 minutes? Maybe tell the judge that when you are there, that he's wasting the judges time too. Maybe that's ill advised, but if you feel like making a point.

38 in a 30 is almost 25% faster than the posted limit, that's the equivalent of 81 in a 65, so I think you need to cool your heels on that one. Sounds like he gave you the stop sign one cause he was in a bad mood, or just a jerk. That sucks, I hate getting rude cops. Their job is to protect and serve - and our taxes pay their salaries. You'd get fired from McDonald's if you acted like some cops.

Most I've dealt with have been courteous and professional, but I've seen more than a few times Chicago cops doing d*ckhead things driving around (like turning on lights to go through a read light or parking where nobody else is allowed). That's irritating.

valbowski1980
01-05-04, 08:32 PM
No quotas! Please. Every time a Cop tells me that, I see their nose grow an inch or two :evil: .

Fight the tickets Crevalle. I believe that you should fight every ticket you get. I say this (and CT residents back me up here) because I am constantly tailgated by Staties and it drives me up the walls, that and they pass me doing at least 95 with no lights and not even a turn signal. When you have the power and not to mention a gun, it is easy to abuse it and many do. Not all cops do this but the few who do make the good ones look bad.

Slaab4life
01-05-04, 08:44 PM
when you get your court date, go change the date as soon as you get it. that way the cop won't show up because the court date won't fit into his schedule anywhere. can't tell you how many times this one has worked for me...
I have yet to see anyone wiggle their way out of a ticket while in court unless the officer does not show..then it's an automatic free walk.

What state are you from? Got a ticket a few years ago, 45 in a 35, went to court, cop wasn't there, so instead a representative of his department was there instead. did manage to talk the ticket down 40 in a 35 (payed 50% less than original fine).
I'd go to court, your opportunity to turn the tables on the cop. Ask lots of question like : where was your cruiser? did you clock me or use radar? If radar, when was the last time the radar was calibrated before the traffic infraction? Where their other cars around me, if so how fast were they going? Was the speed limit posted, if so how far from where you caught me was the sign (I'd guess the closer the better, 'oh officer, I was transitioning from the 40 mph zone down to the 30 mph.', etc.
Now for when your actually being pulled over- BEWARE: You are being recorded! The officer flips his mic on and everything while he is conversing with you is recorded. When I went to court, they had a transcript. Just be honest, in a separate pulled-over incident, I was cruising down the street, cruiser going in the opposite direct, he had gotten me. the officer asked if I knew why I was pulled over, I told him I was going a little fast, and he went back to his cruiser, then that feeling of an hour came upon me, second cop shows up with his lights on behind the first cop, at that point I'm nearly staining my seat, but then I remembered its their protocol to have two officers on scene for any traffic stop. Officer comes back, explains that he had stopped me for going 63 in a 50 and handed me a written warning and tells me that I got that because I was honest with him. So in summation, be honest, be aware your being taped, and know that cruisers driving in the opposite direction have the radar technology to catch you!

MonkeyMan
01-05-04, 09:53 PM
Wow...hearing all these stories makes me thankful to be living in central Maine! I've passed state troopers doing a good 15 over, and speed traps doing at least 8 over. Well I just heard that Maine has the second highest taxes in the country, so I guess they're not begging the police for more income at this point. And also...why are people getting tickets for not stopping at stop signs or red lights? Am I just being naive, or is it fairly easy to check for cops before you drive through a stop signal? I've saved myself several times from running straight through my favorite stopsigns by scanning both ways and finding an approaching cop.

And finally...it is your duty as a citizen of this country to fight every speeding ticket you get. Perhaps eventually we can clog the legal system and convince the authorities to enforce speed laws in a more effective manner. I think the only reason not to fight a ticket is laziness.

BEN

DeLorean
01-05-04, 09:58 PM
I think the only reason not to fight a ticket is laziness.


Agreed on that one! that, and maybe having too much money? :lol:

MonkeyMan
01-05-04, 10:03 PM
I was gonna say, laziness or a bad case of affluence. :lol:

If anyone has that second problem I'd be perfectly willing to help!

BEN

bassist5
01-05-04, 10:34 PM
I think the only reason not to fight a ticket is laziness.



Errhmm.. There's not a damn thing wrong with being lazy.. :cheesy:

Cuba
01-05-04, 11:31 PM
OH MY GOD!@! you live in a police state!!! Oh man it must be awful having Fascist and corrupt monsters weilding their unlawful and inhumane nightsticks at your every move. I bet he smashed your headlight out as well. I'm surprised he didn't make you get out of the car and look in the trunk just so he could look at your *****. Those brutish animals...my sincerest belly laughs to you.

Slaab4life
02-05-04, 07:25 AM
Oh yeah, and I am the guy who stops at every stopsign. Don't know why, maybe I'm just not in a huge rush everywhere. Many talk about not having their insurance car on them, or its in the trunk, or lost at the moment. How about just now having one? Mass law doesn't require me to carry one, but I imagine if I venture into another state that does require one I'm totally screwed! Maybe I should photocopy the documentation that my insurance company does give me (8x11 sheet of paper with my coverage) just to be safe.
OH MY GOD!@! you live in a police state!!! Now aday pretty much. Can't do much about it. They have guns. In a nearby city to me they've had such a gang problem with driveby shootings occuring at ANY time, day or night, so now the mayor has proposed random stopping of any cars between the hours of 2am and 5am, could be as random as third, fourth or fifth car to pass the officer... scary.

GearHead
02-05-04, 01:44 PM
open all windows,if daylight take your sunglasses off,if night turn on your dome light,Be honest and polite to the officer(s).If you do get the ticket challange it in court,change the date several times,or have it when the cop is vacationing somewhere.

valbowski1980
02-05-04, 06:01 PM
OH MY GOD!@! you live in a police state!!! Oh man it must be awful having Fascist and corrupt monsters weilding their unlawful and inhumane nightsticks at your every move. I bet he smashed your headlight out as well. I'm surprised he didn't make you get out of the car and look in the trunk just so he could look at your *****. Those brutish animals...my sincerest belly laughs to you.

Not to that extent cuba. However I did have this ******* in a uniform insult me up and down because I didn't alow him to cut into traffic in front of me, the SOB didn't even use a blinker much less have his lights on. When I was in my teens my car was tossed 3 times when the Cop just plain felt like it.

Slaab4life
02-05-04, 07:52 PM
uniform insult me up and down because I didn't alow him to cut into traffic in front of me, the SOB didn't even use a blinker much less have his lights on.
That reminds me of when I was driving around Boston one time. At a traffic light, get the green, two or three cars in front of me, go to take my left hand turn, state trooper who had been in the stopped traffic on my left decided to pull a U-turn away from the intersection, it turned into a three point turn for him, and before he could back up to finish his turn he had me sitting and waiting behind him, he had jammed himself up good with traffic building up behind me and parked cars right in front of him. Funny to see him sitting there waving his hands in the air and being able to see his mouth through his rearview mirror cursing me. Boy, if I were him my face would be red. :oops:

Crevalle
03-05-04, 12:06 AM
Well, personally, I have declared my own type of war on the police. If I see one speed by me without his lights on, the department is getting a call from me to report him (thanks to whoever said that cops hate getting reported!). I will also be exercising my first amendment right of opinion the next time I am issued a ticket. I know that sounds immature, but sometimes you just need to vent a little. I can honestly tell you, I would be much less angry right now had I said a few choice words to the officer who just ticketed me. I feel horrible because I was extremely polite. I even told him when I was going to reach into the glove compartment for my insurance card (which obviously wasn't there).

Here's a little insult to injury. I had to take a two-hour lunch to drive back downtown to prove I had insurance. I waited in line for 30 minutes, and when I got to the counter, the lady said I needed to go to a different area. I was SO angry--you have no idea. I got the insurance fine dropped. But, on my way out of the parking ramp, I seriously scraped my Saab rims because of their unbelieveably narrow cement driving paths.

Did I mention that I also got a ticket last week for expired tabs (which I told the office I had already ordered--which is true). I had March tabs, and thought I had 30 days. That's another $100. My brother-in-law told me this weekend that I could get it dropped if I proved I had purchased tabs. I wonder if that is true?

yfs87
03-05-04, 08:13 AM
first of all, these 50% of cops which are "d1ckheads" as some of you put it, have proally let power go to their head, but there are also good ones, as i have been told at least...lol...never encountered one myself but they are there haha

second here is a lil story bout cops going the other direction...back 6 months ago before i slowed down (due to tickets) i drove like speed racer, all the time, every time. i was coming home from getting this little concoction called a bubble tea and was on this windy little backroad with lots of jumps (if you are over 50) and turns. There is also this covered wooden bridge. i blasted through the bridge, slowed down(as there was a 90 degree turn to the right on the other side), and as i was about to come out, pounded it. this somehow resulted in squealing from i belive my wheels(LOL) as i slid sideways out the other side of the bridge into the oncoming corner. just as i came out...there was a cop...looking me in the face...but thankfully at the time i had delaware plates, which means only a rear, so i just pounded the gas, and flew around the corner before he could turn around (really skinny road, really big car) prob not the right thing to do, but i did it, if i wasnt a skinny road, or if i had front plates, i would have got screwed, since then i have learned my lesson, sort of...due to events not unlike it... anyway i dont know the point of that story but there it is :wink:

Oliver
03-05-04, 01:22 PM
Even though those are some serious tickets, I tell you you have no idea how lucky you all are.
In Belgium, tickets never EVER get lowered. Very much to the contrary! If you contest your ticket here, you immediatly have lawyer costs which are in 99% of the cases higher than the original fine. In addition there's a good chance you will get a "bonus" for "obstructing the course of law". Unless you can PROVE, I mean really PROVE the fine wasn't justified, you're basically screwed and shouldn't bother contesting...
As for being polite, in Belgium there's such a thing called "smaad" which means... a fine if you insult the officer.

A friend of mine got caught going 44(kph) over the limit. 400 euro's and that's that.
My dad got caught going 41(kph) over the limit. He contested the ticket (I was overtaking a lorry, etc...).
Ticket: 800 euro, lawyer costs 350, and a 3 week no-driving penalty.
Go figure :roll:
As for meself I've collected about 400 in fines in the past three weeks. I got caught three times in ten months, and I'm awaiting my driving penalty...

Crevalle
03-05-04, 02:48 PM
Note to self: never to move to Belgium.

fabric
03-05-04, 02:55 PM
Crevalle-

This is turning into you complaining that you got caught. I can sympathize with the stop sign ticket, but with the speeding, "no insurance," expired registration and outraged disgust, it makes me wonder exactly how much of a rolling stop you did.

Look at it from the cops point of view. You were speeding. He then gives you a little rope to hang yourself. You roll the stopsign, maybe even just barely. Pulls you over, because 38 in a 30 is pretty excessive, especially if it's a smaller street. Then you have some excuse about your insurance -whether it's valid or not, he probably gets them daily, so he's less likely to cut you slack.

Clearly I'm speculating a lot, but all we have is your side, and a veritable flow of complaints about how you been done wrong. The icing on the cake being that you essentially blame the goverment for the fact you ran into a curb.

I think a little humility is in order here, a long with maybe just a bit of "chill out" thrown in for good measure. You are taking this way to personally.

Crevalle
03-05-04, 03:39 PM
Fabric--I never said I didn't do anything wrong. Read the posts. If you can find a sentence where I said I was blameless, I'll give you $410. You're totally missing my point: the cop didn't have to screw me with three different tickets. If he was a decent guy, he could have said, "Listen, I could nail you with three tickets, but I'm only going to give you one for speeding. If I see you fail to come to a complete stop again, I'm going to throw the book at you." I would have graciously accepted my speeding ticket.

I can't stand bureaucrats who say, "Well, you were guilty, and you deserved it." If everyone got tickets for every traffic law they broke, we'd all be literally broke. Where do you draw the line, Fabric? At what point are we simply being harassed by a revenue-hungry government? At what point is it an injustice? I would like to see how you'd react getting $410 in tickets, in one evening. Let me guess: you'd thank the officer for doing his "job" and that you really appreciate his by-the-book mentality. It's easy being an armchair quarterback, isn't it Fabric?

Oh, and I wasn't "blaming" the government for my wheels. If you read the post, you'd see it was "insult to injury." In other words, it was peripheral damage that would not have occurred had I not been mandated to prove I had insurance. Please stop reading into things, and acting self-righteous.

Jezzadee
03-05-04, 03:51 PM
What gets people uptight usually is not the fact that they got caught but the percieved injustice, ie they were fined doing 34 in a 30 when 10 minutes earlier someone had cut them up and gone off at 60. If I get a fine and was in the wrong, I can deal with it. If I get a load of other charges thrown in unfairly, I would be fuming. But people are like that - it's luck of the draw how you get treated at the time. I have no idea about this particular case other than what I've read, but can we PLEASE not have this either turn into another tedious political tirade or a series of personal attacks on each other. I'm not a mod, just another member, but it's getting boring.

fabric
03-05-04, 03:55 PM
But, on my way out of the parking ramp, I seriously scraped my Saab rims because of their unbelieveably narrow cement driving paths.




Yup, that wasn't your fault, it was the fault of the narrow driving paths. You can send the $410 to the charity of your choice.

DeLorean
03-05-04, 04:04 PM
bet fabric is a real nice person to be around :roll:


please...

Crevalle
03-05-04, 04:05 PM
"I scraped my rims..."

Fabric, please don't ever consider a career in law. You seem to have difficulty deciphering guilt.

Repeat: "I scraped my rims..."

Not the government, not the ramp, I did.

Emphasis on the "I"

The driving path was very narrow, but "I" scraped the rims BECAUSE the path was so narrow. The curb was almost entirely black from tire-rub.

ejenner
03-05-04, 04:43 PM
The problem with these people is that they aren't very powerful in real life (not smart, not strong, not quick witted, not athletic, not kind, not attractive, whatever it happens to be...) - so they put on the uniform and make up it whilst they are at work. They replace the failing part of their personality by exercising their power over another... which is wrong.. :evil: :evil:

The criminals operate on a sub-level tho... in this country only law abiding people suffer. Youth offenders cannot be properly punished, so they carry on offending, which makes our lives uncomfortable.

Courts and levels of escalation are just as bad as Belgium though. I think there's more you can do to get off the ticket before it's issued. But there's no fighting the system in this country either :( :(

On a lighter note - cops in this country tend to write things down (instead of tape recording) so if you start talking nonsense they have to write that down as well and it reallly irritates them. Then they stop writing stuff and allow you to talk with them and you can often get around them.

fabric
03-05-04, 04:52 PM
After all you went through Crevalle, that you brought it up, and the way it was stated, there was a clear implication. Of the "I shouldn't even be here today!" variety. Come one, we've all had those moments. No need to play semantic games, the definition of "is."

DeLorean, don't roll your eyes at me, I've seen you lay into a few posters in your day. I'm treating this like any argument I have with my friends - soon as it's over, it's forgotten. Nothing wrong with a little written sparring, as long we don't hold a grudge. Or get excessively nasty, which I don't feel Crevalle has, nor have I intended on my end.

This board wouldn't be very much fun of we wore kid gloves all the time.

fabric
03-05-04, 04:54 PM
(deleted double post, I duplicated the above)

DeLorean
03-05-04, 05:00 PM
at the time it just seemed like a rather nasty thing to say. I admit, I rip on people here from time to time but typically I have a somewhat better reason when I do. He didn't exactly say it wasn't his fault you know. <--

ejenner
03-05-04, 05:07 PM
well defended fabric - but unless your a civil servant, officer of the law or in any way connected with the political or justice systems

- then you are one of us. An ordinary citizen going about life in a humane manner.

And it's not nice to feel victimised by the system.

I got beaten-up on the street recently and when I called the cops they didn't show up. I had my nose broken and got cut up a bit and and was bleading - the police did absolutely nothing. I even got told to go home and grow up through an intercom - after being told to go and see them at a police station that wasn't even open. That was an absolute disgrace... :evil:
They always seem to be around when I don't need them tho... which really, really pisses me off... :evil: :evil: :evil:

Crevalle
03-05-04, 05:29 PM
Isn't a traffic cop the lowest form of cop? I'm not trying to rip on them (well, not REALLY), I'm just sort of curious. Don't new cops get sent to traffic duty? I always thought that it was some type of low-level position.

If I was a little dumber, I could've been a cop too. What a great line.

fabric
03-05-04, 05:51 PM
I'm not certain where traffic cops fall into the police hierarchy, other than they are certainly above parking cops. I think unless you are an investigator, cops are all sort of on the same plane. I.e, if you wear a uniform, you're kind of a "grunt" (that's not mean as an insult, more of the idea of an non-commisioned officer in the service). I'm sure it's more complicated that that.

I think I'm coming from my view from having overall good experience with cops. I've called 911 (the US's emergency number) twice, once for something where I needed them, another from what sounded like a neighbors domestic distburance. There were multiple cops there in I swear 2 minutes. Whatever it was, I was amazed at the swift response. When they came to my place , they were very courteous and helpful, although there wasn't a huge amount they could do for this situation. These were Chicago cops, who most people think are total jerks.

ejenner, if I was treated like you were, I'm certain I'd take a dim view of the police, that's a real bummer.

CleveSaab
03-05-04, 11:01 PM
A) Wolfe gave good advie. Turn dome light on, leave hands on wheel, explain any movements you may make.
I got pulled over once and did this.
(Don't remember the verbatim conversation, but...)
"You must have been pulled over a lot to be so cooperative" laugh
"no, my friend is a cop, he coached me"
"What district?" (my 'friend' was someone I had met once).
"You know, I'm not sure because he is a Cleveland cop but he works at the airport" (not in Cleveland).
Only recieved one ticket instead of 3.
B) Traffic cops are the rookies. Why? They are the ones that usually end up chasing bad guys. I'd rather have some young guy chasing the bad guys than some old fat cop (see C).
C) I have no qualms with cops, but I do have a pet peeve when I see some cop that is horribly out of shape. ... and I see that too often. Who you gonna' catch??? I think a requirement of being a cop should be STAYING IN GOOD SHAPE! Nothing more disgusting than a REALLY LARGE, OBVIOUSLY OUT OF SHAPE COP. I just want to say something SOOO bad when I see them.

Crevalle
04-05-04, 10:24 AM
Gives new meaning to the word "pig."

DeLorean
04-05-04, 03:56 PM
A) Nothing more disgusting than a REALLY LARGE, OBVIOUSLY OUT OF SHAPE COP. I just want to say something SOOO bad when I see them.

I have seen this before. Saw this one cop up north of PA driving in a dodge intrepid cop car. I kid you not, I do not know HOW he got into the thing :o No joke, we are talking 450lbs PLUS! I mean, I was almost in shock when I spotted him getting into the car, I almost ran it off the road :!

stevehayes01
04-05-04, 04:45 PM
[quote="sethsev7n"]
Ive gotten pulled over 5 times.. 4 for speeding.. and only once i got a ticket (it was on a highway with a california highway patrol man..ick).


I share your feeling on the California Highway Patrol I have had more than 1 run in with California's finest. They have a reputatation as being the hardest nosed cops in the US and I am here to testify that is 100% true!!!! and I have the 4 tickets to prove it!!! lol :D :D

ejenner
05-05-04, 01:01 PM
Traffic cops over here are specially trained to deal with traffic situations. They have fast cars. The highest level of driving qualification you can obtain in this country is the qualification held by traffic cops.

In our police service you start off "on the beat" (walking the streets) then you have the option to move into a different department - traffic is one of those departments.

lexcoptk
10-05-04, 09:40 PM
Wow, fellas, I really don't know where to start. There are several posts I would like to respond to but I am a little late in the discussion to hit them all, so I will try to catch a few of them.
First, in my department, our Traffic Unit is considered the elite. The Traffic Unit gets the best equipment, the newest cars the newest technology and the competition to get into the unit is fierce. Generaly rookies start out on patrol. Usually third shift. The Traffic Unit officers don't rank any higher or lower than any uniformed officer (for that matter our detectives don't out rank the uniformed officers either we are all the same rank until Seargent). Our Traffic Unit is also the hardest working unit in the department. We are the ones who get called out for fatal collisions as well as getting called out to map major crime scenes because we have the equipment to do it quickly and accurately. We have a virtually unlimited overtime budget and many opportunities for further training.
I realize that there are some bad cops out there. Those who took the job for the "power" or to feel important or whatever, but for each of those I can show you several who truly care about their community and it's citizens. Sometimes people forget that police officers are human too. We have our good days and bad days at work just like everyone else. Maybe the officer was rude because the last person he stopped cursed him and his family and basicly told him what a low life no good S.O.B. he is just for doing his job. Maybe that officer is having problems at home, he and his wife are fighting because he has to work long hours and is never home. And if you say that he shouldn't bring that to work, I say look at yourself, if you can totaly remove your personal life from your work, than fine go ahead and criticize.
Now some of you have complained about officers speeding and not getting in trouble. I realize that there are those out there who do speed without cause. But there is another side. There are several different calls that have the potential to turn real bad real quick, but are not considered "emergency" calls (lights and siren)unless there are extenuating circumstances. These calls include disorders and domestic violence. Domestics are one of those that require a quick response due to their possible volitillity. So I may drive a little faster to get there, or I may pull up to a red light, wait for traffic to clear then hit the lights, go through the light then turn off my equipment after I'm through the intersection. I am not saying that this is always what is going on, I am just saying that the average person does not always know what is going on behind the scene.
Okay, now to the original question, traffic stop etequitte. When stopped, the best bet is don't undo your seatbelt, don't reach for your wallet or anything else. Just sit there with your hands on the wheel. I will tell you what I want you to do and when I want you to do it. That is simply for my safety. Second, if you treat me with respect I will give it in return. I don't always cite for every violation I find, but be assured if I get some type of rude comment after giving the ticket, I will be sure to add the other violations to it.
Now I can't speak for every officer out there, but I usually don't stop anyone for anything less than 15 mph over the limit, and my stop sign standard is equally as liberal. I don't have a quota, as a matter of fact last month I only wrote 26 citations (granted I was in training classes three weeks out of the month).
I know that I didn't get to even half of what I wanted to. I realize that I am probably the "black sheep" of saabcentral now but, it is hard not to take some of this stuff personally. If anyone has any questions feel free to ask. I will respect your opinions and maybe I can shed a little light on some of the avenues that might not be known to most people.
Oh yeah, just incase you are wondering, I am 6'0" tall, weigh 220 lbs, and work out at least four times a week and I bench 275 lbs max.

DeLorean
10-05-04, 09:54 PM
a matter of fact last month I only wrote 26 citations

Only? :o pardon me for saying but that does seem like a lot to me :oops: in insurance costs alone, you are probably talking $50,000 there over a period of 3 years, at the very least...

lexcoptk
10-05-04, 10:07 PM
26 citations averages less than one a day, and 90% of those were for speeding. As I said I give 14 mph before I stop someone. At 15 over you know you are speeding, if you can't handle the consequences, don't drive so fast. I don't write tickets for anything that I do myself. I was tought to drive five over as not to back up traffic, so I don't write tickets for five over. Not to mention that if the people I write the tickets too go talk to the prosecutor, chances are the amount of the fine will be reduced dramaticly and if they are eligable to do so and take traffic school, their insurance cost will most likely not be affected. (I do know about that from experiance in my younger days.)

Willy Wonka
10-05-04, 10:54 PM
Ok I've got hi school kids who work for me and want to be cops when they grow up. They aren't into power any more than the rest of us. They do have a bizzar sense of humor when they observe blatant stupidity (including some of mine). Maybe it's because they're young but they have an agenda, and it's valid. There are laws that are worth having (did i just say that, dementia). Case and point, a 22 yr old guy in a new bronco decides to break the laws of physics at 110+mph gets air borne lands on a 55mph "by stander", bounces into a pond. Nasty, I would not have wanted to be the 55 mph guy. So how do you curb morons? A gps with an automatic kill switch?
I've probably been given the benefit of the doubt more times than not. Also be aware that some folks work things out from behind the wheel. Nasty day, so they drive nasty, then they get into trouble, and are still nasty, so nasty stuff happens to them. The 110mph airhead had just been in a traffic jam for 15 mins.
Perhaps if he had gotten has ssa in the sling when he was 16 he might not have done what he did at 22. Btw an explorer of all the unstable suvs.
And Cuba you sarcastic teddy bear, road warrior . 8)

Rhino2.3t
11-05-04, 04:28 AM
lexcoptk - i wouldn't say that your comments would make you a black sheep.. pretty suprising that an officer does actually cite on the publics behalf, i.e. reasoning and safety in hand with flexibility and interpretation of whats happening at any given time - and even to the point of being a real person, and being fair in his work :o
i totally agree with the work/personal life / long hours statement - i wouldnt like people cussing me or my family, or offering me donuts before snatching the bag away all day long. One other thing, not many police officers in my experience maintain 'real person' status - both from the publics perceived view of them (it only takes one bad cop), and the internal 'club' mentality of some people..

as for speeding tickets and idiot driving - don't do it 8)
get on a track day if you must howl cars round, or buy a powerboat and enjoy millions of sq. miles of empty ocean.. theres kicks to be had without risking other folks lives.

hooo rant over. *goes back to sleep*