A new style gatso ? [Archive] - SaabCentral Forums

: A new style gatso ?


Big Nev
19-03-04, 04:08 AM
I've never seen one like this before.
It's on the A38 southbound north of Bristol
And it's situated 500yds away from another Gatso.
And it's hidden behind a sign
And it's 15'high
No doubt going to be used to catch out motorists who speed up after the other Gatso :nono;

mikej
19-03-04, 04:35 AM
It might be height related.

To catch 7.5 tonners or over, as you know Nev you get a different speed limit to cars and the previous Gatso's cannot tell if you are a car or an HGV.

Well thats what i think it is anyway.

greenphotos
19-03-04, 04:36 AM
Ahhh, Much better :

GearHead
19-03-04, 09:57 AM
"the only good gatso is a dead gatso"

Alex
19-03-04, 10:57 AM
Fortunately the bottom half of the road sign is missing at the moment so the camera can be seen.

I've noticed that they have removed the flashing 40 sign that used to make people slam on their brakes and slow to 30!

Licence
19-03-04, 01:07 PM
Driving to pick my girlfriend up from work last night, at around seven thirty, I saw a copper setting up a mobile trap ahead.
It's at a point where a two mile long two lane 50mph limit becomes a single lane 40mph limit (this being in a non residential area as well). They set up there all the time but never anywhere in the two miles leading up.
This makes me think that they want to catch people doing 45-50 in a 40 zone to earn some cash and aren't at all bothered by the people doing 60-70 in the two miles beforehand.
Last night, however, the traffic lights at the junction ahead had failed (this being within sight of the policeman) and nothing was being done to sort out the mess ahead :evil:

Big Nev
19-03-04, 01:21 PM
It might be height related.

To catch 7.5 tonners or over, as you know Nev you get a different speed limit to cars and the previous Gatso's cannot tell if you are a car or an HGV.

Well thats what i think it is anyway.

mike,it's probably not that,as the road is a 40 zone dual carriageway,and lorries,7.5t and over, can go 40 here no probs
It is triggered by sensors in the road too.

I imagine that some local lout will decide to climb up it,fall off,break a few bones and end up in a hospital :roll:

Matthew
19-03-04, 02:39 PM
It's at a point where a two mile long two lane 50mph limit becomes a single lane 40mph limit
The Police laser guns have a range of upto 1 kilometre. I expect the Police are seeking to catch motorists travelling in excess of 50MPH further up the road.

There's nothing unsafe about travelling at 70MPH if the conditions permit on a dual-carriageway stretch of road that's not in a residential area. Just because the speed limit's reduced to an excessively low 50MPH doesn't mean it's suddenly unsafe to still travel at 70MPH.

I imagine that some local lout will decide to climb up it,fall off,break a few bones and end up in a hospital :roll:
Well when they do, for once I hope they'll take full advantage of the our litigation culture and take the Speed Camera Partnership to the cleaners.

Dan1
19-03-04, 02:42 PM
...isn't a random big yellow thing kind of obvious? even if it is behind a sign... :-?

DeeCee
19-03-04, 06:46 PM
Cheeky *******:evil: I HATE THEM!!
No concern for saftey at all. :evil: :evil:
ehem..(cough) sorry :roll:can't help but get angry with any sort of trap. After clocking up 9 points I'm now very paranoid when driving:cant afford a pucka detector either.
May as well sell the 16s and get a vespa.


mod edit

nutcase
19-03-04, 07:29 PM
Maybe it's so they can get 6 number plates in the photo? Cut costs and get 6 times as much cash...

Munki
19-03-04, 07:50 PM
get a vespa.
Now't wrong with Vespas mate... :nono;

DeeCee
19-03-04, 08:03 PM
get a vespa.
Now't wrong with Vespas mate... :nono;

Exactly: my point being that,I love the shape of mi 900.
The only way for me reduse risks of speeding is,in gest, to get something a lot slower but as near to being equally pleasing to the eye. My favourites were Lambretta's, but I'd probably still get nicked: the ones I had were far quicker than my old 50 special :oops:
Lambretta and c900... great designs.

Cuba
19-03-04, 09:22 PM
Automatic Height Detection Device

Zelandeth
20-03-04, 05:37 PM
Well, my take on speed cameras is simple: They cause more pileups than they increase safety.

Best one we have on a road here is on a dual carrigeway (10 miles or so), 70 limit, on a loooong downhill stretch. Naturally, having come up the hill, if you're not watching, you can quickly find yourself doing 80, 85 (Well, I do, and I'm in a Lada for goodness sake!), then suddenly, horror - you see the Gatso. Automatic reflex action is to stand on the brakes. At which point the idiot in his 17" alloy equipped Saxo with racing slicks on who was trying to drive up your tailpipe goes straight into the back of you. Never happened to me - yet - but I;ve seen it many, many times.

Aberdeen has a heap of them, and some of them are really sneakily placed. Two are totally invisible until it's too late. On the country roads I've been known to be a bit silly now and then, but around town, I'm totally paranoid about cameras!

DeeCee
20-03-04, 05:58 PM
Solution to the problem.....
Burn Burn Burn ! Kill Kill Kill! :evil: :evil: :evil:
I never get tired of saying: I hate them! And anyone who is connected with the production or their instalation,maintainance,up-keep and revenue collection-and all the familes and friends connected to those parties involved.(for 2 generations back,just to be safe.) :cheesy:
Other than that, I'm quite mellow really.

Matthew
22-05-04, 10:07 AM
I think it might have been a Tri-Eye 1000:
http://www.ukspeedtraps.co.uk/gatso12.htm

http://www.ukspeedtraps.co.uk/jpg/3head.jpg

Alex
22-05-04, 01:24 PM
It could well be. The camera definitely has wires in the road for the triggering mechanism, and as such cannot be picked up with a radar detector. The Origin database is up to date though. :D

Tone_Depear
22-05-04, 01:59 PM
I imagine that some local lout will decide to climb up it, try do do some ironing atop it, fall off, break a few bones and end up in a hospital :roll:

Tsk.

ZARS
22-05-04, 03:11 PM
KILL KILL :evil: :evil: :evil:

(sorry chaps, don't know what got into me :oops: )

Rhino2.3t
22-05-04, 04:49 PM
toptip for not having to ride a vespa (nowt wrong wi em mind).. invest in suitable burbly exhaust, then when around town concentrate on maintaining the 1500rpm 'sweet spot' resonance.. at approx 33mph 8) makes more folks smile without thinking 'saxonova' and gives you something to do.
like playing some pretol powered musical instrument :D

worked a treat on/in previous Ducati/Alpina.

john-w
22-05-04, 07:03 PM
How about this one! A normal gatsco on the top left of the picture followed by another facing you a few meters later. Anybody know what the 2nd camara does??

mikej
23-05-04, 03:36 AM
I guess the gatso does your speed and the other proves who was driving?

Ricky Lake
24-05-04, 05:02 AM
Hmmmm, I'm increasingly thinking that I need to get myself one of these new fangled detector things (complete with GPS database and all that...). I've got close a couple of times to driving through a camera trap and not being at exactly the right speed (I get caught out when away from home as near me all the cameras are the Gatso's and as soon as I head north into bedfordshire they seem to have the forward facing ones that you have to spot a couple of hundred yards earlier....).

There was something a while back that talked about getting a bunch of people together and doing a 'bulk purchase' of a decent detector and saving money that way...

I might be interested if others are?

R.

Paco
24-05-04, 05:15 AM
Cheeky *******:evil: I HATE THEM!!
No concern for saftey at all. :evil: :evil:
ehem..(cough) sorry :roll:can't help but get angry with any sort of trap. After clocking up 9 points I'm now very paranoid when driving:cant afford a pucka detector either.
May as well sell the 16s and get a vespa.


mod edit

Thats what I did after getting 9 points...except it's a bit of an XJ-C shaped Vespa...... :wink: Bye Bye T16 though... :cry:

Matthew
24-05-04, 06:39 AM
There was something a while back that talked about getting a bunch of people together and doing a 'bulk purchase' of a decent detector and saving money that way...
This already happened:
http://www.saabcentral.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=21549

However, I believe David might be able to supply more units at a discounted price.

I can certainly recommend the Origin B2. It made itself indispensible within the first twenty miles of usage, and now I wouldn't be without it.

Jetset
24-05-04, 08:09 AM
Rather than spending all this time money and effort on avoiding being caught, has anyone considered that it might be far easier to pay attention to the speed limit signs and then not break the limit.

Just seems to me this would be the easiest and cheapest and least stressful option all round...

:wink: :cheesy: :lol:

Paco
24-05-04, 08:46 AM
Just seems to me this would be the easiest and cheapest and least stressful option all round...

:wink: :cheesy: :lol:

I'll take issue with this!!!

Less stressful???? :o Have you driven down the M3 at 70 mph??? :wink: It's downright scary.... you overtake the odd artic but EVERYTHING else is doing 80+ including 7.5 tonners, Merc Sprinters galore, moving into the middle lane is a lottery!!!

Far safer and easier to be sat in an 80 mph cruise than to try and dodge in and out of it :wink:

I reckon I'm a considerable hazard. And that's just when I'm driving :cheesy:

Jetset
24-05-04, 11:03 AM
Less stressful???? :o Have you driven down the M3 at 70 mph??? :wink: It's downright scary.... you overtake the odd artic but EVERYTHING else is doing 80+ including 7.5 tonners, Merc Sprinters galore, moving into the middle lane is a lottery!!!

Must be a different M3 to the one I drive on every day then, can't say I have a problem travelling at 70 on it... but then I have the long running problem that my speedo might be under reading so maybe I'm doing the safe 80mph without realising it ;)

That and I'm usually on in rush hour, so mostly I'm lucky if the traffic manages more than 60 :D

mikej
24-05-04, 01:22 PM
So how many times do you see umpteen speed camera signs and no actual speed limit signs?

They seem very happy to put up the camera signs but not the limit ones :roll:

So while you think you know the limit there is a camers sign and you think well what is the limit?
The GPS systems tell you what the limit is, so you know a, where the camera is and b, what speed you should be doing.

Not like people who see a camera and automaticly brake suddenly to 30 even though it's a 50 limit.

Jetset
24-05-04, 02:38 PM
So how many times do you see umpteen speed camera signs and no actual speed limit signs?

They seem very happy to put up the camera signs but not the limit ones :roll:

So while you think you know the limit there is a camers sign and you think well what is the limit?
The GPS systems tell you what the limit is, so you know a, where the camera is and b, what speed you should be doing.

Not like people who see a camera and automaticly brake suddenly to 30 even though it's a 50 limit.

I understand that side of the argument, but to be honest I expect it is just used as a speeding tool to avoid detection, I'm very sceptical that people buy them because they want better information on the speed limits.

The other point is if you are paying attention (many people who speed use "concentrating more" as an excuse) then you should know what the limit is on the stretch of road you are on, it's not all that difficult, and if in doubt its not that much of a disaster to slow down a bit.

The other question is one of social responsibilty your own personal feelings. I have come within less than an inch of hitting someone who ran out in front of me in a 30 limit, fortunately I was doing just under the speed limit at the time on a road that most people think is safe to do 40. Chances are if I had been doing 40 I would have killed them.(interesting fact a pro-speeding friend told me the other day, I've not done the maths personally but, apprently if you take the highway code reaction and stopping distances if I had being doing 40 at the same point when I breaked I would have been doing 30mph at the point of impact, which would probably have been fatal).

I personally couldn't live with myself if I was in a crash and killed or sevearly injured some as a result of speeding. So I make the choice to stick to the limits (or less if circumstances warrant it). I know that I still may end up injuring someone an accident, but I will know that I was doing my best to safe and trying to be a responsible motorist. Speeding may not not cause more accidents (the debate is still out on that one) but in the event of a collision the higher the speed the more likely it is to be fatal.

mikej
24-05-04, 02:52 PM
I know, but can you honestly say that you know the correct speed limit on EVERY strech of road you travel on.

I know for sure i dont.
And i dont generally speed but was thinking about a GPS detector with speed limit info purely for the times when you are not sure of the limit.

I know a road by me (Raggy will also know it(link between A45 and Browns Lane Jaguar plant road)) where the opposite happens.
National speed limit on a dual carrage way = 70mph but they go down it between 30 and 50mph, and theres no speed cameras or signs for them.

Jetset
24-05-04, 02:59 PM
I know a road by me (Raggy will also know it(link between A45 and Browns Lane Jaguar plant road)) where the opposite happens.
National speed limit on a dual carrage way = 70mph but they go down it between 30 and 50mph, and theres no speed cameras or signs for them.

I'm pleased to hear that :) I have to say that I think you are amongst a small group of people who would actually do that.

ragtopcav
24-05-04, 03:27 PM
Funny really, I used to be pompous and sanctmonious about speeding driving skill etc.

recently I got GATSO'd, the unit was within calibration so I'm going to have to accept the fixed penalty they've offered me.

Came as a valid wake up call to my own humanity and inabilities [i'm human, i'll make mistakes, i'm not an error proof automaton]. Reading past posts and threads i've made with my holier than thou attitude towards such things i now feel that I should apologise to those of you whom I've lambasted in the past. Also this should serve as a warning to those of you that place yourselves on a moral pedestal the fall is considerably longer.

philo
24-05-04, 04:28 PM
Off at a bit of a tangent but I've noticed something odd with several of the newly installed Truvelo type cameras round Birmingham and I wonder if I'm missing the obvious.

The camera faces you as you approach it but the stripes on the road are beyond it (on its' blind side so to speak). The question is, do Truvelos need stripes on the road? There maybe a good explanation for this but I'm forced to jump to the conclusion that they're installed by idiots.

Alex
24-05-04, 05:27 PM
The other point is if you are paying attention (many people who speed use "concentrating more" as an excuse) then you should know what the limit is on the stretch of road you are on, it's not all that difficult, and if in doubt its not that much of a disaster to slow down a bit.
It can be very difficult to work out some 30 limits if they are only set by the spacing of streetlights, as opposed to using signs. Even coucils get this wrong when setting limits and have tried to prosecute people for speeding in '30' zones, when the road doesn't actually conform to the requirements and should be classified as 60s.

The other question is one of social responsibilty your own personal feelings. I have come within less than an inch of hitting someone who ran out in front of me in a 30 limit, fortunately I was doing just under the speed limit at the time on a road that most people think is safe to do 40. Chances are if I had been doing 40 I would have killed them.(interesting fact a pro-speeding friend told me the other day, I've not done the maths personally but, apprently if you take the highway code reaction and stopping distances if I had being doing 40 at the same point when I breaked I would have been doing 30mph at the point of impact, which would probably have been fatal).
It takes over 1/2second to complete a scan of the speedo, including time for the eyes to refocus. Someone who is concentrating on the speedo in the desparate attempt to avoid exceeding 30 is probably paying less attention to the road than someone who is driving at 30ish but is actually concentrating on the road, pedestrian behaviour and other threat assessments.

Alex
24-05-04, 05:30 PM
Off at a bit of a tangent but I've noticed something odd with several of the newly installed Truvelo type cameras round Birmingham and I wonder if I'm missing the obvious.

The camera faces you as you approach it but the stripes on the road are beyond it (on its' blind side so to speak). The question is, do Truvelos need stripes on the road? There maybe a good explanation for this but I'm forced to jump to the conclusion that they're installed by idiots.
Truvelos are activated by piezo electric strips in the road just before you get to the camera. They don't need the white markings as they are triggered by the car crossing two fixed points in the road.

Gatso need the road markings to determine which car has actually triggered the camera and also to prevent false alarms from the radar reflecting of the wheels.

Ricky Lake
25-05-04, 02:45 AM
I think this 'speed' issue is one that is going to run for a while...(and not just on this forum)

I'd agree that speeding is not a good thing and can be socially irresponsible. Having said that, it is also culturaly acceptable (if not, why did we all have pictures of Ferraris/Lambo's/99's/etc. on our walls when we were kids - because they were uncomfortable, impractical, unreliable or because they did 180mph?)

If we are going to have strictly enforced speed limits, then the limits need to be sensible and credible (ie not a 30mph limit on clear dual carriageway). While I may at times exceed a national limit (I've been known to drift up to 72mph on a motorway :P ) I will also find myself doing 20mph (ie. under the limit) in town, near schools, etc. It is a case of driving responsibly for the environment you're in.

At 5.30am on a summer morning on an empty motorway I could make a case for 110mph being safer than doing 60mph on the same stretch of road in rain and heavy traffic. The speed limit is the same in both cases. In the "good 'ol days" a decent traffic cop would take account of this - once stopped for doing 95'ish under aforementioned empty conditions and was told not to be a silly boy and slow down. A camera would make no distinction...

The reason I'm considering getting a detector is because human judgement has been taken out of the equation and I want something on 'my side' to help make more informed decisions when driving. This isn't because I want to drive faster than I do currently (and I'm not a speed freak despite having bought an aero) but because I don't want to end up getting my picture taken by the side of the road in conditions where a police officer would be able to use their judgement.

Summary: I don't agree with excessive speed, it is wrong and dangerous. I don't agree that we have got the correct speed limits on all roads in this country. I don't agree with removing the 'human judgement' element of assessing whether someone is driving with 'excessive' speed. I do think that the only place where we should open up our cars is on a track.

Please feel free to agree or disagree

R.

Abbott 900
25-05-04, 04:16 AM
Off at a bit of a tangent but I've noticed something odd with several of the newly installed Truvelo type cameras round Birmingham and I wonder if I'm missing the obvious.

The camera faces you as you approach it but the stripes on the road are beyond it (on its' blind side so to speak). The question is, do Truvelos need stripes on the road? There maybe a good explanation for this but I'm forced to jump to the conclusion that they're installed by idiots.
Truvelos are activated by piezo electric strips in the road just before you get to the camera. They don't need the white markings as they are triggered by the car crossing two fixed points in the road.

Gatso need the road markings to determine which car has actually triggered the camera and also to prevent false alarms from the radar reflecting of the wheels.

There is one of these exactly as you describe just outside Gosport... But a few months back it was just a regular Gatso, so I think they are just reusing the Gatso mast, sticking a new top bit on and swinging it round a bit, but then not removing the white markings on the other side of the road...

Jetset
25-05-04, 04:28 AM
It takes over 1/2second to complete a scan of the speedo, including time for the eyes to refocus. Someone who is concentrating on the speedo in the desparate attempt to avoid exceeding 30 is probably paying less attention to the road than someone who is driving at 30ish but is actually concentrating on the road, pedestrian behaviour and other threat assessments.

Sticking to the speed limit does not mean spending your entire time stareing at the speedo, I would hope that most people are capable of traveling at 30 mph without any reference to the speedo, I would be willing to bet money that I could drive within 10% of 30mph (either side) with the speedo and rev counter covered up, purely using gear and engine / road noise as the key. I don't drive around in a "desparate attempt" to avoid 30, I try to travel at a safe speed at or below the limit frequently it's below the limit, and it this case it probably saved somebodys life when "most" people think it's perfectly acceptable to do 40 in the same spot.

Also, assuming I had just looked at my speedo, in the case of 30-40 on that road, even with an extra 1/2 a second to react and start breaking, the pededestrian would still have been toast.

Having said all that, I am prepared to believe that there are a small percentage of people who are capable of making safe decisons about what speed is safe on a given road, and a number of them are also prepared to travel at less than the limit when appropriate.

However... these people don't make up the majority of the road uses, not even close. And thats the problem, road legislation, speed limits etc. have to be for the majority of the people on the roads. Most people out there cannot make a safe decision, and you cannot tell externally if a person is capable of making a good decision about breaking the limit, or just being an idiot.

So we have speed limits, they are easily measured and enforced and do a reasonable job of stopping at least some people who would otherwise drive stupidly fast. A speed limit places some kind of guidance on the people who are not capable of making a good decision and what harm does it cause people who are capable for going faster safely? Answer not a lot, it takes a bit longer, *shrug* so what?

I understand that it's fun to drive quickly, I've done rally courses and track days etc. and it's great fun. Doesn't mean I drive like that on the public roads, I don't think it's safe. Sticking to the limit is fine with me, maybe some times it takes a bit longer to get somewhere, but then I use a route planner and make sure I have enough time.

philo
25-05-04, 03:48 PM
Off at a bit of a tangent but I've noticed something odd with several of the newly installed Truvelo type cameras round Birmingham and I wonder if I'm missing the obvious.

The camera faces you as you approach it but the stripes on the road are beyond it (on its' blind side so to speak). The question is, do Truvelos need stripes on the road? There maybe a good explanation for this but I'm forced to jump to the conclusion that they're installed by idiots.
Truvelos are activated by piezo electric strips in the road just before you get to the camera. They don't need the white markings as they are triggered by the car crossing two fixed points in the road.

Gatso need the road markings to determine which car has actually triggered the camera and also to prevent false alarms from the radar reflecting of the wheels.

There is one of these exactly as you describe just outside Gosport... But a few months back it was just a regular Gatso, so I think they are just reusing the Gatso mast, sticking a new top bit on and swinging it round a bit, but then not removing the white markings on the other side of the road...

Hmmmm. I can see the logic there but these cameras are brand new where no camera stood before. Maybe it's in case they want to swap the Truvelo for a Gatso at some time in the future. Makes me smile when I see people braking on these stripes - too late pal :nono;

mikej
26-05-04, 04:02 AM
Jetset,

The problem is the cameras are doing people for 33ishmph in a 30mph limit, and the dangerous ones (40mph plus) get treated the same.
Yet the drunk drivers etc go virtually undetected because if they drive at 30 they are not picked up.
And there is no accounting for how some people even got a licence.

Jezzadee
26-05-04, 04:53 AM
The majority of people I know who have points (i.e. family, relatives etc.) are not 'fast' drivers. Many prefer to go at 50 in a 60 because they feel more comfortable doing so. They nearly always get the points by for example doing 50 in a 40 where the 40 is not adequately signposted and they genuinely thought they were doing the speed limit. I have come across this many times. It's easy to say that they are not then paying enough attention, but I have been in similar situations. While I know the limits in my own area, when I went up to Yorkshire recently the dual carriageway I was on changed from 70 to 50, then 60, then 40, all within a few miles with no obvious reason. Fair enough - I'm sure there is a reason, its just not obvious to me. But the absence of correctly spaced repeater signs frequently meant that I was slowing down upon seeing a camera without being able to recall if I was in a 40 or a 60. Include the fact that I was trying to navigate as well and the whole thing became trial and error. In Suffolk we have many convictions currently being challenged because of inadequate signposting of limits - technically many Suffolk limits are illegal due to the failure to comply with their own regulations regarding notification. In addition, and I am the last to condone dangerous driving, the new lowered limits between Ipswich and Lowestoft has led to worse driving in the 3 months that they have been established, as most of the 60 on an A road through open countryside is now a 40. One journey I do often takes me 50 minutes on the A road, doing the speed limit, 25 minutes on the B roads, doing the speed limit - and it is 4 miles further on the B road. Even the local police recognise that this is ridiculous, and that it has led to increased impatience and more risk taking. Many of the local councils are concerned that the standard of driving has worsened as a direct consequence of the lower limits, and there are regular appeals in the local papers, not necessarily to raise the limits everywhere, but simply to be more realistic about what is a safe speed. Many of the people writing the articles are actually policemen, highway engineers and others whose views should carry some weight. It is too easy to say that drivers are in the wrong, and that they should obey the limit no matter what. Yes of course they should, but if the limit is unrealistically low, they won't. No amount of cameras will change that - they'll simply do what they do now, 65 in the 40 which used to be 60, 30 through the villages (most stick to this, in reality) and slowing down for the cameras.

Jetset
26-05-04, 05:44 AM
It is too easy to say that drivers are in the wrong, and that they should obey the limit no matter what. Yes of course they should, but if the limit is unrealistically low, they won't. No amount of cameras will change that - they'll simply do what they do now, 65 in the 40 which used to be 60, 30 through the villages (most stick to this, in reality) and slowing down for the cameras.

Wow that was tough to read, some paragraph breaks would be nice :P

I have to agree with the point I have quoted though, I full recognise that some of the speed limits on our roads need a review, and I would be 100% behind a complete review of speed limits, and criteria for deciding speed limits on our roads. I agree that there are a number of limits that could be safely rasied, and a number that could do with being dropped.

Having said that I have little or no time for people who deliberatly speed and then moan about police enforcement of speeding, or whine they got caught. Cameras are usually just a useful ranting point, and in my experience people moan and whine just as much if they are stopped for speeding by a police officer - in some cases even when the officer lets them off with a warning :o

If people want to start a sensible campain for a re-assesment of speed limits, including things like demonstration marches etc. then I would be there with them.. as long as they are prepared to accept the outcome if the limits do down as well as up ;) A collection of random individuals breaking the limits because they just don't like them is in many circumstances dangerous and is not the kind of focused effort that will get policy changed.

If people really want the speed limits re-assed because they genuninely think there is a need for it, and that the roads would be safer then I am all for it, however I think that most people don't really care about safety, they just have the desire to go fast and no concern about the consequences of their actions. (yes there will be some exceptions, but I think that the majority of people fall into this category)

This is a worrying trend in a number of things in modern society probably, in the UK at least, steming from 80's Thatcherism and the "so long as I'm ok screw everyone else" mentality that was promoted at the time.

Jezzadee
26-05-04, 06:24 AM
Sorry about the paragraphs - I'm enjoying a few days off work (I'm an editor :oops: :D )

I agree with you that many people do not think enough about the implications of their actions with regard to speeding. I do believe, though, that many people try and be as safe as possible while still occasionally, and often unwittingly, breaking the limit to an extent - for example, the many replies on this thread that express frustration that road conditions are not taken into account, or the number of us who run Daytime Running Lights even though there is no legal obligation to do so.
[para]
Part of the frustration seems to stem from the failure of the government to listen fully to people and organisations that have studied the issue - http://www.abd.org.uk/ springs to mind, as well as http://www.pepipoo.com/ - and this is coupled with a suspicion of the revenue generated by the cameras. As soon as the system became a free for all, with private companies able to set up speed traps with the government's blessing, and then investing the profits in buying more equipment to catch more speeders, people began to wonder whether the motive was actually with road safety primarily in mind after all. In my view we have already reached the point where the system is showing its flaws, in that people who work in the business of road safety are expressing disquiet at the way the camera partnership is being run.

While the statistics are notoriously easy to manipulate, it certainly appears to the average driver that there are cases where, like the A12, the current policy has done more harm than good. Couple that with the numbers of businesses who use ports in other regions to transport goods into the UK due to the laughable journey time in this part of the country, and the consequences are far-reaching.

In effect I can't see any speed limits being properly reviewed with safety paramount as long as the people who are given the job of enforcing them are the ones in whose interest it is to catch as many people as possible due to it being their sole source of revenue.

Alex
12-06-04, 11:34 AM
The Department for Transport has just released a list of the Top 10 contributary factors in UK accidents.

1) Inattention
2) Failure to judge other person's speed/path
3) Looked but didn't see
4) Behaviour - careless/thoughtless/reckless
5) Failed to look
6) Lack of judgement of own path
7) Excessive Speed
8) Slippery road
9) Impairment - alcohol
10) Behaviour - in a hurry

Speed only gets mentioned as a cause at 7, and even then it is listed as Excessive Speed not speeding. Cameras would have difficulty in picking up any of the other causes.

Matthew
01-10-04, 06:54 AM
I drove past that speed camera a couple of weeks ago, and noticed that there are no timing marks on the road.

The camera is almost invisible until you drive past the enormous road sign behind which it's concealed.

Alex
01-10-04, 11:24 AM
I drove past that speed camera a couple of weeks ago, and noticed that there are no timing marks on the road.

The camera is almost invisible until you drive past the enormous road sign behind which it's concealed.

They did actually move the sign inwards to make the camera more visible.

This type of camera doesn't need marks on the road (same as with DS2 and Truvelo) as they are triggered by the passage of the car over the inductive loops in the road which are a set distance apart. The white lines are only required on the gatsos as the radar system is notoriously bad and some form of check is required.

DeeCee
02-10-04, 07:50 PM
:lol: Strange you should bring this one back Matthew.
It's going to a sound a bit daft and off key, but anyway -
I was traveling through the Limehouse link tunnel in East London not so long ago, when I noticed new signs warning of cameras. Every one was checking a creepy 30 mph, so, I followed suit. Just as I thought I was out of the woods(or tunnel), you (Matthew) came into my thoughts (nothing gay or anything, I'm happily married :cheesy: )- I remembered a thread about enjoying the sound of the engines in confined spaces or something like that.
So I opens the window a begin to floor it.
What a lovely sound indeed.
The tunnel climbs a hill towards the end.
16s with its Exhauste roaring, turbo whistling, - then - the camera flashing..

Those b*m-holes had mounted a Gatso to the roof of the tunnel facing downwards.(I only detected it when I was there at another time later on).
Couldn't see the marks on the road until I was over them :oops:

Thankfully I haven't had any presents in the post as yet. If I do, thats me gone, last strike.

I really need a radar me thinks. But, 400 boys, is not convenient to weigh-out in one hit for me.
I've seen some other ways to get myself a radar but it's not like those decent ones from the group buy on this site.
I think its a 400 quid Road Angel - to be paid by installments.
:-?? Anyone got any views or experience with such items?
Cheers,
Dean

Matthew
03-10-04, 06:21 AM
I have an Origin B2. The unit almost immediately became indispensable.

Get yourself an interest free credit card, buy an Origin B2 and pay it off over several months. I guarantee that the fine imposed by a magistraites' court for disqualification as a totter will be most of the cost of an Origin B2 (or similar product).

In addition, there's at least 3 x 60 fixed penalty fines = 180, plus increases to your insurance premiums. Buying a GPS camera unit is cheaper by far than losing your licence.

IIRC I paid 300, plus a bit extra for the 2nd car kit.

PS: If you've not received an NIP within two weeks of being caught, then you're in the clear (postal delays not withstanding).

Alex
09-11-04, 05:24 PM
Walking past this camera yesterday lunchtime a group of people were working on it. Seemed to involve laying cables out towerds the pickups in the road, so the camera may be live now.

Si
16-11-04, 01:25 PM
Perhaps if enough people go out, get drunk, then injure themselves whilst mounting speed cameras we can sue the company out of existance for not displaying a sign warning that they should not be climbed on as it 'may result in injury'!

ragtopcav
16-11-04, 03:38 PM
Perhaps if enough people go out, get drunk, then injure themselves whilst mounting speed cameras we can sue the company out of existance for not displaying a sign warning that they should not be climbed on as it 'may result in injury'!Perhaps there should be an organised group going around smearing vaseline over the lenses :nono;

Rob in Atlanta
16-11-04, 04:58 PM
Perhaps if enough people go out, get drunk, then injure themselves whilst mounting speed cameras we can sue the company out of existance for not displaying a sign warning that they should not be climbed on as it 'may result in injury'!

I thought frivilous lawsuits like that happened only in the US. Hmmmmm. I read some figures somewhere that 3/4 of the cost of a ladder is based on personal injury awards.

Rob in Atlanta

Zaphod Beeblebrox
18-11-04, 07:09 PM
Just read that a mobile speed camera that works in the dark is going to be trialed in January in the UK. Big Brother, you are 20 years late, but Nanny knows best. :oops:

Matthew
18-11-04, 07:14 PM
So do conventional laser-based mobile speed cameras (such as the LTi 20-20) not work in the dark?

ragtopcav
18-11-04, 07:37 PM
So do conventional laser-based mobile speed cameras (such as the LTi 20-20) not work in the dark? They need a flash camera to take a picture, the laser itself is its own light source but old fashioned evidence is required.

I should imagine the new all weather & night time cameras use infra red imaging.

Alex
19-11-04, 02:43 AM
Just read that a mobile speed camera that works in the dark is going to be trialed in January in the UK. Big Brother, you are 20 years late, but Nanny knows best. :oops:

I would like to know how the police can legitimately use a handheld system at night. The Police operational procedures state that the operator must first have a suspicion that the vehicle is speeding which is then confirmed by the laser measurement system. It is very difficult to judge speeds at night.

Marrk
19-11-04, 03:47 AM
Please read the info on this site...

http://www.safespeed.org.uk