Speedparts open air kit [Archive] - SaabCentral Forums

: Speedparts open air kit


finklejag
17th November 2003, 07:26 PM
I just got off the phone with Nick at Genuine SAAB. The open air kit from Speedparts should be out pretty soon. They have done 30,000 miles of R&D on it.

http://www.speedparts.se/proj/ss1_openair.jpg

Pooter8D
17th November 2003, 09:57 PM
what is this open-air thing u talk abooot?

Vector-SS
17th November 2003, 10:07 PM
Im still confused on whether to buy this open air kit or just forget about it since almost everyone on this forum think its useless....is it?

finklejag
17th November 2003, 10:12 PM
We will have to see if Speedparts puts the car on a dyno with this kit.

Vector-SS
17th November 2003, 11:41 PM
hmm...yeah that sounds pretty good. Have u heard of any approximation of pricing?

finklejag
17th November 2003, 11:57 PM
Not yet. I will let everybody know when I find out myself.

Vector-SS
18th November 2003, 05:21 AM
I was recently surfing speedparts website and I found out that the pricing for the open air kit is already on !

1590 SEK = 209 US
1590 SEK = 274 CAD

not bad pricing at all. Now we need to see if their is any increase in HP.

Pooter8D
18th November 2003, 10:12 AM
can someone explain this open air thing to me?? is this a replacement to the air filter??

finklejag
18th November 2003, 09:47 PM
can someone explain this open air thing to me?? is this a replacement to the air filter??

Yes, it replaces the air filter box. Some people install these to bring in more cool, fresh air. It sits away from the engine. The factory airbox does a great job. People think that is still is too close to the hot engine. There is still a cone sytle filter at the end of the pipe. In some cars, you will see a gain, other you won't. We will have to see what Speedparts post for this product.

finklejag
19th November 2003, 12:16 AM
Here is a picture of all the parts that come with it.

http://www.speedparts.se/images/prod/filter/xf-980.jpg

Cayman1
19th November 2003, 10:23 AM
I will be surprised if they try to sell that for $209 US.

You could make that setup yourself for less than $100 US.

Liquid Calm
19th November 2003, 11:28 AM
I saw this on the speed parts sight as well. I had a cold air intake in my WRX but I cut it down to a short ram due to increased lag. The 9-3 has a lot less lag then the WRX so I think I will hold of and buy this cold air over the drop in filter when it is out here. Still would like to see some reviews though.

55spy
19th November 2003, 07:03 PM
that cheesy flex hose will offset alot of the gain of getting the air from somewhere cooler. all you will have is cooler air that is turbulene. if they had properly bent pipe at 209 bucks well worth it but not a $40 filter with tw0 $2 clamps and a flexible rain gutter drain diverter to connect em!

finklejag
19th November 2003, 07:06 PM
I thought it looked like a dryer vent hose :P

mbodo
19th November 2003, 09:59 PM
I thought it looked like a dryer vent hose :P

Looks like corrogated drainage pipe :roll:

vector93
19th November 2003, 11:41 PM
At the speed that the air is flowing through that pipe you wont have much if any turbulent flow.

Saba
19th November 2003, 11:46 PM
At the speed that the air is flowing through that pipe you wont have much if any turbulent flow.I would say you would have more. High speed air molecules colliding with the corrugated surface will be be scattered far and wide. Greater forces at work causing greater turbulence. Slow speed air will be less turbulent. Think of water flowing through a stream, much less turbulence in a slow moving current.

Viscouse
20th November 2003, 12:33 AM
Haven't actually tried this, so apologies if it's a bonehead idea, but why not just use a section of clear tubing? Smooth, cheap, durable, flexible, and best of all you can see the air going through it! :cheesy:

vector93
20th November 2003, 08:08 AM
At the speed that the air is flowing through that pipe you wont have much if any turbulent flow.I would say you would have more. High speed air molecules colliding with the corrugated surface will be be scattered far and wide. Greater forces at work causing greater turbulence. Slow speed air will be less turbulent. Think of water flowing through a stream, much less turbulence in a slow moving current.

Thats my point. The air wont be moving fast enough through the tube to cause a significant amount of turbulence. In order to achieve turbulent flow through a pipe you would be suprised at the actual flow rates necessary. These are also dependent on the fluid.

Cayman1
20th November 2003, 09:51 AM
There is obviously a reason why all intake systems are made from smoothe piping and why people spend money extrudehoning (polishing) their intake manifolds.

the smoother the better.

vector93
20th November 2003, 12:13 PM
Well when you are talking about polishing an intake manifold you are talking about smoothing the walls of the flow channel to ensure that the fluid flow in the boundary layer stays laminar and does not become turbulent. The ridges in this pipe are much more macroscopic when compared to that. Being as the actual walls of this plastic pipe are smooth then the air flow will stay laminar in the boundary layer.

55spy
20th November 2003, 12:16 PM
Ther are alot of things to look at actually other than just the surface type. Volume, diameter changes flow rate. under full throttle the air is moving at a significant rate, changes in volume as the air passes through the engine change the velocity of it, that is the reason some K&N FIPK kits have those funny looking bulbous air channels to increase the rate of the air entering the induction system without starving the system with a continuous volume tube. and if you think that a rough suface does not affect airflow why mandrel bend an exhaust, why polish a set of heads, it all matters?

vector93
20th November 2003, 12:16 PM
And the reason that most intake systems are made from smooth plastic tubing is the ease of manufacturing and lower cost for mass produced vehicles. I would wager that the reason this tubing has these ridges is because Speedparts needed flexible tubing in order to eliminate the need to engineer a precisely sized and shaped rigid plastic intake.

vector93
20th November 2003, 12:20 PM
I am not saying that a rough surface doesn't matter. Actually if you read my post I said it does matter. These ridges in the Speedparts intake system do not represent that kind of microscopic surface finish. These ridges in this pipe are much to large to cause turbulence. And yes all those other things were taken into consideration when I made my original statement. I didn't get a degree in Mech. engineering for nothin.

Vector-SS
20th November 2003, 03:36 PM
so are you guys basically saying that this is of cheap quality and the ridges dont allow it to perform to its fullest

vector93
20th November 2003, 05:36 PM
I am saying the ridges will have no effect on its performance.

finklejag
20th November 2003, 06:47 PM
I want to see it on a dyno. That is the only thing that would make me buy it. Speedparts installed this on their project car last Octomber. They spent the last year and 30,000 miles doing R&D on it.

SS
20th November 2003, 09:44 PM
I wouldn't really expect all of you guys to completely believe the dyno testing results though!!

mbodo
21st November 2003, 12:15 AM
I want to see it on a dyno. That is the only thing that would make me buy it. Speedparts installed this on their project car last Octomber. They spent the last year and 30,000 miles doing R&D on it.

here here! .. SS, why wouldn't you 'believe' the dyno results? I'd 'believe' a dyno graph over a website saying "15+ HP!". A little bit of effort/evidence is better than none at all, no?

mav238
22nd November 2003, 05:26 PM
I really don't see why we are all here so gung-ho about this "SUPER" increase in intake airflow. :o

Even if you put a 5" tube to ram the air in, I doubt you get any real significant increase in Hp. The ECU must be programmed to deal with the increase in airflow. The exhaust tuned to draw out the excess combusted air/fuel mixture created by this increase in airflow.

I put on the high performance OEM replacement filter to hopefully gain a better engine response (not Hp) and also better fuel economy.

If I really wanted to make my 9-3 go like a porsche, I would probably have to spend close to at least $5000 to get the:
1. performance ECU
2. mated performance airtake
3. mated performance tuned cat-back performance exhaust
4. tuned springs/Koni shocks
5. high performance turbo intercooler

Just look at the 2004 BMW 330i, now with the EHP package offered to new buyers, with all the retuning, only 10Hp increase, and 10 lb/ft torque (but mind you, more usable torque).

Just MHO. 8)

mav238
22nd November 2003, 05:28 PM
I really don't see why we are all here so gung-ho about this "SUPER" increase in intake airflow. :o

Even if you put a 5" tube to ram the air in, I doubt you get any real significant increase in Hp. The ECU must be programmed to deal with the increase in airflow. The exhaust tuned to draw out the excess combusted air/fuel mixture created by this increase in airflow.

I put on the high performance OEM replacement filter to hopefully gain a better engine response (not Hp) and also better fuel economy.

If I really wanted to make my 9-3 go like a porsche, I would probably have to spend close to at least $5000 to get the:
1. performance ECU
2. mated performance airtake
3. mated performance tuned cat-back performance exhaust
4. tuned springs/Koni shocks
5. high performance turbo intercooler

Just look at the 2004 BMW 330i, now with the EHP package offered to new buyers, with all the retuning, only 10Hp increase, and 10 lb/ft torque (but mind you, more usable torque).

Just MHO. 8)

oops...I forgot to add:

6. a much bigger turbo with the appropriate wastegate and boost controller
7. high performance camshafts
8. high performance fuel injectors

pjku79
12th December 2003, 05:31 PM
I am not saying that a rough surface doesn't matter. Actually if you read my post I said it does matter. These ridges in the Speedparts intake system do not represent that kind of microscopic surface finish. These ridges in this pipe are much to large to cause turbulence. And yes all those other things were taken into consideration when I made my original statement. I didn't get a degree in Mech. engineering for nothin.


Any change in flow into the intake will effect the performance. The ridges may not cause the air to turbulate but it will disturb the flow. No one will know how much it will effect it until it is actually tested. I would offer to do it on my car but I am not getting it til the end of the month. Also the radius of the bend will effect the flow. And for the record I have a ME degree too, not that it matters.

Vector-SS
14th December 2003, 06:21 PM
So any updates concerning the open air kit from speedparts? I always hear of coming upgrades then they suddenly vanish out of no where

WASAAB
11th January 2004, 05:03 AM
So any updates concerning the open air kit from speedparts? I always hear of coming upgrades then they suddenly vanish out of no where
Yes..I'm curious too.. :P

pjku79
12th January 2004, 11:24 AM
So any updates concerning the open air kit from speedparts? I always hear of coming upgrades then they suddenly vanish out of no where
Yes..I'm curious too.. :P

they probably figured out we were on to their cheap upgrade and decided to actually do some engineering instead of producing some pos plastic tube. i agree with the talks above. if you want to get optimal performance out of an upgrade like this you need to stay as smooth as possible. there are lots of shops out there that specialize in head flow. the reason they dont go out of business is because the flow does matter. it matters alot. personally i will save my money til someone actually developes something worth putting on my car.

as for an upgrade if you are going to go through the trouble of adding this i would just get my own tube (a little longer), a k&n filter, and some hose clamps. i was actually thinking about cutting a hole where the foglight would have been and running the hose to there (ram air). but, im waiting to see how much horsepower the engine can actually handle before i start making mods, since ive read some performance shops blew engines at like 260hp. who knows the reliability of the engine if its at 240hp, maybe only last 50000 miles. not something i want to test out on my car.

Cayman1
12th January 2004, 11:31 AM
I actually just bought a Blitz SUS metal cone filter and was planning to do what you just said. I wanted to remove the whole air box and connect a hose to directly to the intake manifold tube, but the problem is that the air flow sensor is mounted on the air box so I guess we would need a tube fabricated to mount the the AFS on it.

i was hoping it would be a little easier than this. and this won't add enough horsepower to blow anything.

vector93
30th January 2004, 03:18 PM
So any updates concerning the open air kit from speedparts? I always hear of coming upgrades then they suddenly vanish out of no where
Yes..I'm curious too.. :P

they probably figured out we were on to their cheap upgrade and decided to actually do some engineering instead of producing some pos plastic tube. i agree with the talks above. if you want to get optimal performance out of an upgrade like this you need to stay as smooth as possible. there are lots of shops out there that specialize in head flow. the reason they dont go out of business is because the flow does matter. it matters alot. personally i will save my money til someone actually developes something worth putting on my car.



Not on this scale.

finklejag
30th January 2004, 03:33 PM
Speedparts R&D this kit for one year on their SS. Contact Nick@GenuineSAAB. See if he can get some data from Speedparts.

DrBoost
2nd February 2004, 08:34 AM
Hej !

Please open the bonnet of uor 9-3SS and look at the top of the aircleaner box. As you can se, the Airmass meter is of a drop in style. This means that it's VERY sensitive to any mods. of the "tube" that it's fitted to.
The size and shape of the tubing before and after the AMM is critical. Incorrect installations such as the one mentioned above will cause incorrect airmass value.

My opinion is that this kit should not be installed in a 9-3SS, ever....

Javier
2nd February 2004, 10:46 AM
Hi Dr Boost!

It is great to see your post here. Are you able to advice what is the efficency of the 9-3SS Linear's Garrett turbo and the Aero's Mitsubishi turbo. What are their maximum HP they are capable of?

Thanks in Advance.

Cayman1
2nd February 2004, 10:50 AM
The turbo in the vector/aero's are the TD04 which is used in the WRX and they seem to crank them up to 300hp without problems.

Javier
2nd February 2004, 11:11 AM
I understand that the island of efficient of the TD04HL15T-5cm2 use on the B235R engine is only up to 280hp. Anymore power, will perhaps need to upgrade to a bigger turbine area.

Liquid Calm
2nd February 2004, 11:14 AM
Cayman 1 is right, the TD04 in the WRX was good to around 300hp or so a few cars got down into the 12's with it. go here http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/ for more info then you ever wanted on Scooby’s and the TD04.

However with out knowing the compressor wheel trim in the TD04 used in our SS, it would be hard to say what kind of power we could get out of it.

Anyone out there know what the trim size of the compressor wheel is in our TD04?

Cayman1
2nd February 2004, 11:17 AM
Liquid Calm,

do you know if we have ceramic turbines?

My old car was and i couldn't safely push it past 15psi without shattering the exhaust (ceramic) wheel.

Liquid Calm
2nd February 2004, 11:29 AM
Cayman1,

I do not know if it is ceramic or not......
Anyone out there with some spec's on our TD04 please help us out :!

joshd2012
2nd February 2004, 03:23 PM
but, im waiting to see how much horsepower the engine can actually handle before i start making mods, since ive read some performance shops blew engines at like 260hp. who knows the reliability of the engine if its at 240hp, maybe only last 50000 miles. not something i want to test out on my car.

There was one Saab performance place that made this claim, but it was generally dismissed because of numerous other performance places saying it was suitable to upgrade. The T8 is just a speciallize version of the EcoTec engine which has been tested up to 1000hp. When I get my car, I will be upgrading it until I get up to 300hp. Beyond that, I imagine the maintainence would overshadow the performance, but that is something to be seen.

DrBoost
2nd February 2004, 03:28 PM
Hej !

B207E (150 bhp/240Nm)
B207L 175 bhp/265Nm)
Use the Garrett GT2052S
------------------------------
The Aero uses a MHI TD04L-14T
B207R (210 bhp/300Nm)
------------------------------

If I had to choose between the two candidates, I would pick the MHI unit. Just because the MHI is a higher quality unit.
And also, better performance.

That brings us to "maximum ratings", a very simple question to ask, but at the same time very difficult to answer.
The -14T compressor can be stressed to some 300 bhp, however, it's not the best choise.

Maximum engine power, depends on many different things, you can't say that a compressor size is producing this or that amount of power.

Trying to answer in another way, IF I had a 9-3SS non Aero, I would fit the TuRbocharger from Aero (TD04L-14T),Injectors (green), Camshafts, Intercooler, Exhuast system (cat back), Early Aero airfilter box.

Increasing the power in a B207E or L up to power levels far above B207R level in not very proffesional, without h/w improvements....