Passat 3.6 4Motion - No thanks. [Archive] - SaabCentral Forums

: Passat 3.6 4Motion - No thanks.


raquettelaker2
28-08-09, 05:05 PM
My mom's '06 Jetta 2.0T DSG went in for a new catalytic converter under warranty today. I got home from work this afternoon all excited to see a Passat 3.6 4Motion in the driveway as her loaner car. It was a 2006 sedan with 36k miles in that booger green with tan interior, not that it matters. What a DOG!!! Besides the fact that it reeked of smoke like a cheap hotel inside, it was no miracle to drive. The auto transmission/rear diff whined like a dog, and the exhaust had a really coarse droning sound. It was smooth but sounded just like my 4-cyl 9-5. It had NO BALLS behind it's 280hp rating, I almost wonder if something was wrong... Getting back in the Jetta with the little 200hp 2.0T gave me whiplash when I stepped on the gas compared to the 3.6. Just goes to show that power to weight ratio using small light engines and turbocharging is the way to go!

zachc
28-08-09, 10:28 PM
ha, funny stuff.

yah, my friends charger got hit and he got a 2007 jetta that was a POS! haha the mirror was broken and it had a nasty interior haha. we beat the crap outta that things. we did donuts in my neighborhood and would just floor it all the time. so funny. ah the joys of driving a rental:lol:

900t
28-08-09, 11:48 PM
Maybe the guy pulled one or two wires to the injectors so he wouldn't have to replace the transmission and tires every 10 000 miles because of idiots trying to do burnouts and neutral slams :lol:

Nathan 9⁵
29-08-09, 02:40 AM
I totally agree with you! My little sister has a Turbo Beetle, and it's been such a needy car. I'm always on call and at her service. But when I can't help out, she takes it in to the dealer and gets a loaner. We always go through them looking at how they're made and criticizing how cheap they look and feel. Just a few weeks ago I tore through all of the vacuum lines replacing them all. Well the hardened plastic hose to the brake booster had several large cracks in them, causing a lean CEL and making the brakes lack all power assist. VW's use to be my thing, and I've owned several, but their quality is just so low.

The Passat you're speaking of has an awful interior. NEW cars rattle and when you touch the plastic on the dash it creaks and makes awful squeaking sounds. The fake wood is SO horrible too. It makes our Saabs look stellar. The 2.5 5Cyl is also a dog to drive, and the standard audio systems have SO many resonating rattles in the door cards.

raquettelaker2
29-08-09, 08:17 AM
We just got the Jetta a couple weeks ago and it's the exact opposite of everything you're describing here. It's a VERY impressive little car. It's a 2006 2.0T DSG with 34k miles on it. It has almost every option (Package 1, Package 2, and Luxury Package) with genuine leather seats (they smell great), Xenon lights, spoiler, etc... I think the only things we're missing out on are Nav and a power passenger seat. I have driven it a bunch of times and I find it to be a very solid, fast, fun to drive car. The quality and materials blow my Saab away. It's very comfortable inside. It's kind of an awkwardly "cute" looking car, so that's the only reason it wouldn't be on my list of future potential cars. There are so many cool little features that the Germans obviously put a lot of time into. We'll see how reliability turns out... we have a CPO warranty for a while.

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c326/raquettelaker2/712096675.jpg
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c326/raquettelaker2/712096827.jpg
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c326/raquettelaker2/712097107.jpg

Nathan 9⁵
29-08-09, 11:38 AM
Well, I'm glad you like it. I like the Jetta much more than the Passat. I absolutely hate the Passat's cheap interior. It's all pretty plastic in either car tho. Some of the plastic textures look like milk jug texture. But some of the plastic texture in the 9-3 look the same... But back to the Jetta. The Jetta 2.0T is impressive, that turbo is sure swift, and the DSG transmission was purely amazing to drive. But the engine was so loud at idle! The direct injection click is just too annoying for me. But the performance made up for that, and then some. Take those door cards off. Fake wood. The dash wood is fake too. And looks fake. Just like the '06+ 9-5 wood is fake, and looks fake. And the hard styrofoam impact absorbers are clipped onto the inside of the door card with tiny clips, not epoxied in like the Saab. They will eventually start to rattle, if they don't already. The leather on the doors is also genuine pleather, not real leather like the Saab 9-5 door cards. The paint quality on the '08 I got as a service loaner last had a lovely orange peel texture to it, and not a smooth finish like the Saab. And that dash. Its a lint and dust trap, and oddly porportioned behind the cluster hump to make it dificult to vacuum clean. I like the Jetta dash control layout very much. And none of the plastic creaked when you touched it like the Passat did. Oh, and those lovely rubber covered buttons on the steering wheel wont stay pretty for too long if they're used often. They're going to start to look like pimples. Same thing with that plastic plug beneath the drivers airbag. Then the carpet. Thin, easily worn, and give me a break with those super cheap floor mats. I'd expect some thicker pile carpeting, with an embroidered edge, like the ones in my Saab and Volvo, not thin pile, glorified felt, with a thin cloth edge comparable to a KIA. And last but not least the Mexican production just kills it for me.

I hope your families Jetta is a more reliable car that my sisters turbo Beetle, because all of that pretty plastic stuff sure wasn't made to last in her car. She got her car new, and drives it like a girl, not a boy racer. I'm the one who gets to maintain it. So far it's needed complete window regulators, not just replaceable rollers, all 4 coil packs (that left her stranded), MAF's, O2 sensors, transmission wiring harness(stranded on the side of the freeway), coil pack wiring harness (left her stranded again), AC compressor, auto dimming mirror, door lock modules, turn signal flasher module, a heated seat switch had a stinky melt down, a hatch opener module, a spoiler deflector arm, a door speaker, several complicated, and expensive 3 way vacuum check valves that were made to last a whopping 20-30K miles, and several trips to the dealer for diagnosis. Most of this stuff happened after her short new car warranty, so it was out of my parents pocket, and my handy labor. It's still a nice car, it's still impressive to drive, but the build quality of the parts of the car isn't impressive.

So in my opinion, and from my long and previous experience with VW, VW over all quality isn't up to the over all quality in my Saab or my 12 year old Volvo. If the sum of the parts that make up a really nice car isn't good, the really nice car wont be nice for long. I haven't had a real problem with my Saab since I've owned it. I've put about 60K on it, and all that's gone wrong is the SID unit, and a dead battery that eventually killed the alternator on a long trip. And some plastic sunroof clips that I think are crap, but haven' failed yet. We've had so many problems with the Beetle, and a friend of mine who has a Jetta 2.5 has had nearly the same problems, and his car is a rattle trap, and the textured buttons on the dash all look like hell, which in my opinion depreciate the car so much. And unlike the Saab 9-3, the buttons are not replaceable.


Oh, I forgot. A friends Audi A4 3.0's info screen in the cluster has lost a lot of the pixels. Good luck with the info screen in the Jetta, it looks very similar to the Audi's, just mexican made.

raquettelaker2
29-08-09, 11:53 AM
Well, I'm glad you like it. I like the Jetta much more than the Passat. I absolutely hate the Passat's cheap interior. It's all pretty plastic in either car tho. Some of the plastic textures look like milk jug texture. But some of the plastic texture in the 9-3 look the same... But back to the Jetta. The Jetta 2.0T is impressive, that turbo is sure swift, and the DSG transmission was purely amazing to drive. But the engine was so loud at idle! The direct injection click is just too annoying for me. But the performance made up for that, and then some. Take those door cards off. Fake wood. The dash wood is fake too. And looks fake. Just like the '06+ 9-5 wood is fake, and looks fake. And the hard styrofoam impact absorbers are clipped onto the inside of the door card with tiny clips, not epoxied in like the Saab. They will eventually start to rattle, if they don't already. The leather on the doors is also genuine pleather, not real leather like the Saab 9-5 door cards. The paint quality on the '08 I got as a service loaner last had a lovely orange peel texture to it, and not a smooth finish like the Saab. And that dash. Its a lint and dust trap, and oddly porportioned behind the cluster hump to make it dificult to vacuum clean. I like the Jetta dash control layout very much. And none of the plastic creaked when you touched it like the Passat did. Oh, and those lovely rubber covered buttons on the steering wheel wont stay pretty for too long if they're used often. They're going to start to look like pimples. Same thing with that plastic plug beneath the drivers airbag. Then the carpet. Thin, easily worn, and give me a break with those super cheap floor mats. I'd expect some thicker pile carpeting, with an embroidered edge, like the ones in my Saab and Volvo, not thin pile, glorified felt, with a thin cloth edge comparable to a KIA. And last but not least the Mexican production just kills it for me.

I hope your families Jetta is a more reliable car that my sisters turbo Beetle, because all of that pretty plastic stuff sure wasn't made to last in her car. She got her car new, and drives it like a girl, not a boy racer. I'm the one who gets to maintain it. So far it's needed complete window regulators, not just replaceable rollers, all 4 coil packs (that left her stranded), MAF's, O2 sensors, transmission wiring harness(stranded on the side of the freeway), coil pack wiring harness (left her stranded again), AC compressor, auto dimming mirror, door lock modules, turn signal flasher module, a heated seat switch had a stinky melt down, a hatch opener module, a spoiler deflector arm, a door speaker, several complicated, and expensive 3 way vacuum check valves that were made to last a whopping 20-30K miles, and several trips to the dealer for diagnosis. Most of this stuff happened after her short new car warranty, so it was out of my parents pocket, and my handy labor. It's still a nice car, it's still impressive to drive, but the build quality of the parts of the car isn't impressive.

So in my opinion, and from my long and previous experience with VW, VW over all quality isn't up to the over all quality in my Saab or my 12 year old Volvo. If the sum of the parts that make up a really nice car isn't good, the really nice car wont be nice for long. I haven't had a real problem with my Saab since I've owned it. I've put about 60K on it, and all that's gone wrong is the SID unit, and a dead battery that eventually killed the alternator on a long trip. And some plastic sunroof clips that I think are crap, but haven' failed yet. We've had so many problems with the Beetle, and a friend of mine who has a Jetta 2.5 has had nearly the same problems, and his car is a rattle trap, and the textured buttons on the dash all look like hell, which in my opinion depreciate the car so much. And unlike the Saab 9-3, the buttons are not replaceable.


Oh, I forgot. A friends Audi A4 3.0's info screen in the cluster has lost a lot of the pixels. Good luck with the info screen in the Jetta, it looks very similar to the Audi's, just mexican made.


Meh, I actually like the "fake" wood on the doors and dash. The picture isn't amazing but in person it's actually quite nice to look at, IMO. Of course there are some hard plastics and the door cards probably aren't leather, but it's an ECONOMY car. I put the Jetta in the same class as the Civic or Corolla, just light-years classier and more fun to drive. The base price of a new Jetta compared to a new 9-5 is $15k less. So far there is one rattle in the dash that will be easy to fix. My 9-5 is much more rattly. At idle I don't find the engine to be any louder than my 9-5. I'm assuming your sister's bug is a 1.8t? Those engine suck. The 2.0T is 100% different and I'm willing to give it a chance.

earthworm
29-08-09, 12:18 PM
I totally agree with you! My little sister has a Turbo Beetle, and it's been such a needy car. I'm always on call and at her service. But when I can't help out, she takes it in to the dealer and gets a loaner. We always go through them looking at how they're made and criticizing how cheap they look and feel. Just a few weeks ago I tore through all of the vacuum lines replacing them all. Well the hardened plastic hose to the brake booster had several large cracks in them, causing a lean CEL and making the brakes lack all power assist. VW's use to be my thing, and I've owned several, but their quality is just so low. This poor quality is backfiring on them.. Toyota and Honda are doing much better, at least in the good ole USA. Or do they too, suffer from the quality/QC bug ???

The Passat you're speaking of has an awful interior. NEW cars rattle and when you touch the plastic on the dash it creaks and makes awful squeaking sounds. The fake wood is SO horrible too. It makes our Saabs look stellar. The 2.5 5Cyl is also a dog to drive, and the standard audio systems have SO many resonating rattles in the door cards.
But VWs, and Fords, and Chevys are cheap, one should expect this.
And Saab, being little more than a glorified Opel could well be the same way.
I only care about our cars ,what little is left, and Saab, of course... :cheesy:

Nathan 9⁵
29-08-09, 12:20 PM
Yep, all turbo beetles are the 1.8T, and they definitely suck. And the price of that Jetta is on par with a higher spec Accord, not a civic. And it's in the league of a base 9-3. It also isn't an economy class, like the mentioned Civic or Corolla. It's classed as mid range sedan. For all of its german engineering, I think it still isn't up to the standards most think of as German cars. And the 2.3 in the 9-5 is not a quiet, or very smooth idler. But I dont have a 2.3. And before you compare it to the V6 you knew, my V6 doesn't have 160k+ , or almost 100K old spark plugs, like your V6 did. I also don't have any rattles, yet. And I'd never want fake anything, which is why I don't like the '06+ 9-5s'. You can see a huge leap backwards in terms of interior materials in the '06+ 9-5 interior. :nono; But this isn't about the 9-5. This is about over all quality of VW's. No argument the car is awesome. What I'm arguing is the parts that make up the car are not up to German car standards. Or my expectations for that price.

Nathan 9⁵
29-08-09, 12:25 PM
I don't know Earthworm... Honda's are not as great as people think they are. They have some notorious transmission troubles in quite a few cars. And their interior bits wear out, fall off, and rattle very quickly. THose thin chrome plated plastic door opener handle things always delaminate and break. The fabric on the door cards also come unglued and sag. But Hondas are like those ultra comfortable Levis you own. You don't care much if they tear, or get stained. THey're just old blah jeans. Your slacks you care about, and if a button comes unsewed, you're pissed and expect better, like our Saabs.

raquettelaker2
30-08-09, 12:43 AM
Yep, all turbo beetles are the 1.8T, and they definitely suck. And the price of that Jetta is on par with a higher spec Accord, not a civic. And it's in the league of a base 9-3. It also isn't an economy class, like the mentioned Civic or Corolla. It's classed as mid range sedan. For all of its german engineering, I think it still isn't up to the standards most think of as German cars. And the 2.3 in the 9-5 is not a quiet, or very smooth idler. But I dont have a 2.3. And before you compare it to the V6 you knew, my V6 doesn't have 160k+ , or almost 100K old spark plugs, like your V6 did. I also don't have any rattles, yet. And I'd never want fake anything, which is why I don't like the '06+ 9-5s'. You can see a huge leap backwards in terms of interior materials in the '06+ 9-5 interior. :nono; But this isn't about the 9-5. This is about over all quality of VW's. No argument the car is awesome. What I'm arguing is the parts that make up the car are not up to German car standards. Or my expectations for that price.

My V6 spark plugs were replaced every 10k miles! And if you put the Aero suspension on your Arc it would rattle. Guaranteed.

Nathan 9⁵
30-08-09, 01:01 AM
oRly? http://www.saabcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=83456

And the first mod I did on my 9-5 was replace all the tires, the struts with Koni FSD's and the Aero sway bar set from GenuineSaab. I may have the stock springs, but with the firmer dampers and sway bar, I still don't have any rattles, and so far haven't driven another 9-5 that did rattle.

Oh no, I'm wrong. My 3rd brake light rattles when the radio is really loud, and there's lots of bass. I *hate* that rattle.

900t
30-08-09, 01:23 AM
Oh no, I'm wrong. My 3rd brake light rattles when the radio is really loud, and there's lots of bass. I *hate* that rattle.

Then open the rear doors and go to that thing and either tighten the screws or figure out what is rattling and stop it

if it is like the bulb fixture moving around just put a piece of foam or something to stop that

then you would have the problem solved :p

Nathan 9⁵
30-08-09, 01:37 AM
Wellll...... This summer I went through my car and replaced all the bulbs. My inspiration was the de-laminating yellow film on the turnsignal bulbs. When I went to remove the plastic cover on the 3rd brake light, of course the cheap plastic tabs broke off with just the slightest touch. Being in the Texas heat didn't agree with it I guess. So I got fancy on it and inserted some small pan head screws securing the cover to the bulb carrier, and now it has a rattle. So what I really need to do is order a new bulb carrier. I think they're $50-$60, I've seen them online but haven't bothered to order it yet. It's one of those back burner things. I wonder why Saab didn't use LED's in the 3rd brakelight. They're supposed to be much safer since they fully illuminate light years before the standard bulbs do. Hmmm, points to subtract for Saab. ;)

lscrx
30-08-09, 02:04 AM
Yep, all turbo beetles are the 1.8T, and they definitely suck.

The turbo-beetles were the red-headed step-children of the VW 1.8T clan, they got the K03 turbo's, smaller intercooler, and smaller injectors (I think). The later model Jetta and Passat 1.8T's had the K04 turbo with a bigger intercooler and injectors, the HO Audi TT was the only 1.8T car with real balls if you ask me.

DanS
30-08-09, 02:15 AM
I've looked at VW's several times over the past couple years and just can't pull the trigger on buying one. The resale is high, they have features, but they are really cheap when you get inside and start looking at them. I also look at the old ones and see how they have rusted or the owners complain about the poor reliability.

They are priced high in comparison to other cars of the same size and features. The Vtex fake leather is horrid. VW doesn't offer leather now unless you spend at least 30K USD.

The mpg is low for the engine displacement (geared for quickness). The suspension is terrible for US city streets, jarring you to death.

Despite all this, I would consider a VW Sportwagen diesel. The service center is close, they get good mileage and the resale isn't bad. I just need to get over the cheap looks of them....

Nathan 9⁵
30-08-09, 02:18 AM
I know this. But it's my little sisters car, she wanted something "cute". The engine itself has been great. Runs smooth enough, is responsive, gets good mileage, her car is the AWV engine, so there's something different, in a good way, about the turbo than the earlier 1.8T engines. It's all the ancillary stuff that's been trouble. The coilpacks, the wiring harness that cracks and wires corroding/breaking, the SAS pump rivets coming apart, the "vacuum suction pump" 3way check valve that falls apart, and the best design of all is the plastic impeller water pump. What were they thinking?!

And I'd think the Passat and Audi A4 1.8T's would be the redheaded stepchilds with their sludge prone issues from the smaller oil pan capacity, and owners using non specified oil in their cars, plus all of the other issues that are common to the 1.8T.

Nathan 9⁵
30-08-09, 02:28 AM
Dan, I completely agree with you. I do love VW's, even tho in this thread it may seem otherwise. I think they're innovative and have a nice personality. It's just a cheap feeling I get from them now. You can see they've cut a few corners, saved a few bucks and went with something that feels, looks, smells, tastes cheaper than what it should for the price. And that vtex "leather" IS horrid, but, it cleans up super easy, and looks like it did when new years later. My friend has a Jetta 2.5 with it, and it's awful looking and feeling, but is super easy to care for and has no wear. My sisters Beetle is a GLX, so it has the real leather, and cosmetically it's held up pretty well. Her soft touch interior bits are still nice too, which is a miracle cause every used VW I've seen looks like Edward Scissor hands has owned the car. :cheesy:

lscrx
30-08-09, 02:29 AM
...And I'd think the Passat and Audi A4 1.8T's would be the redheaded stepchilds with their sludge prone issues from the smaller oil pan capacity, and owners using non specified oil in their cars, plus all of the other issues that are common to the 1.8T.

I only meant that while the other 1.8T cars upgraded to the K04 the Beetle stuck with the K03, and the intercooler on the Beetle is smaller than any other 1.8T car... not that they were less reliable... just less equipped.

Nathan 9⁵
30-08-09, 02:47 AM
The intarcoolurz is tiny on her car. It's funny how small it is. :lol:

But for her, it's more than enough. I seriously don't think that car sees much boosted action, except when I have to drive it. And I try my best not to drive it. ;oops:

Less equipped as in performance right? Agreed. I think it's only 150hp and 160something ft.lbs. Equipment is auto dimming mirrors, rain sensor, leather heated seats, monsoon rattle audio with cd changer, and a TINY glove box.

lscrx
30-08-09, 03:10 AM
...I think it's only 150hp and 160something ft.lbs...

I think that's what my moms '01 Jetta 1.8T is rated at... I dyno'd it at about 155hp and 170lb-ft at the wheels. I think VW under-rated them so they wouldn't "compete" with the VR6 models that were rated at 172hp... which is probably exactly the same amount of power the 1.8T put to the wheels.

The VR6 models were about $4k more expensive, mostly because of the bigger wheels and nicer interiors... but they definitely didn't make much (if any) more power than the 1.8T cars.

raquettelaker2
30-08-09, 07:51 AM
Wellll...... This summer I went through my car and replaced all the bulbs. My inspiration was the de-laminating yellow film on the turnsignal bulbs. When I went to remove the plastic cover on the 3rd brake light, of course the cheap plastic tabs broke off with just the slightest touch. Being in the Texas heat didn't agree with it I guess. So I got fancy on it and inserted some small pan head screws securing the cover to the bulb carrier, and now it has a rattle. So what I really need to do is order a new bulb carrier. I think they're $50-$60, I've seen them online but haven't bothered to order it yet. It's one of those back burner things. I wonder why Saab didn't use LED's in the 3rd brakelight. They're supposed to be much safer since they fully illuminate light years before the standard bulbs do. Hmmm, points to subtract for Saab. ;)

If you buy the new part it comes with metal clips now so they never break.

Nathan 9⁵
30-08-09, 12:34 PM
If you buy the new part it comes with metal clips now so they never break.

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d35/Nathandm78/evil-raccoon-excellent.jpg