Seafoam or what? [Archive] - SaabCentral Forums

: Seafoam or what?


Joel96
5th November 2008, 06:50 PM
OK 1996 900 Saab 192000 miles non turbo 2.3 the car is running fine. However I would like to clean my throttle body and intake. I have been reading in the forums about seafoam, some say it is good some say it is not so good. Does anyone have a good opinion, ideas or recommendation. I have looked for directions and photos of how to use the seafoam, lots of good iformation but what is best? Is there a picture of the vacume line I should use and for how long.
Thanks everyone, I have been able to complete a good deal repairs on my car with your input. Any advice on seafoam or another product is reatly appreciated. Joel:confused:

Darren900
6th November 2008, 10:28 AM
The best way to clean the throttle body is to remove it from the engine, and clean all the mechanical stuff with gumout or some other harsh solvent and clean the electrical contacts and TPS tracks with something like CRC Contact cleaner.

bkrell
6th November 2008, 12:36 PM
Honestly I've clean my TB on my SAABs a few times and I never really found them dirty. Taking it off the engine WOULD be the best way to clean it thoroughly, though. A good solvent would be brake cleaner. Just be careful with it. It's pretty darn harsh. Seafoam's downfall, in my opinion is that it has too much of an oily base. It DOES clean but not as quickly as other solvents out there like Berryman Chemtool. Really, I just mix my own now, when I can. All the component chemicals are available at any hardware store and at much lower prices than you pay for any of these pre-packaged solvents. For under $20, I can walk out with enough to make a couple gallons, at least.

gorillajin
6th November 2008, 06:25 PM
i just used seafoam through pcv hose...no differences what so ever....i saw some white smoke out of the exhaust pipe...that's it. i also used in into the gas tank..............

don't waste your money on it...

Saabohème
6th November 2008, 06:40 PM
The best way to clean the throttle body is to remove it from the engine, and clean all the mechanical stuff with gumout or some other harsh solvent and clean the electrical contacts and TPS tracks with something like CRC Contact cleaner.He has T5 - no fly-by-wire throttle body here, so no pesky carbon tracks on a circuit board to mess with. There is an actual hard-wired TP sensor on the butterfly housing.
I have had very good results with the Chemtool and pretty good results with a little home brew of 50% distilled H2O, 30% Techron, 10% xylol (xylene) and 10% ethyl alcohol.

Cm452
6th November 2008, 06:52 PM
Slight hijack-Since I have no seafoam and nobody carries it, I was just going to decoke my engine with water. However, I figured that disconnecting the intake manifold from the the throttle body elbow and spraying water in a 2k rpm with a mister-this will prevent hydrolocking but still have the decoking benfits-no?
-Cm

Saabohème
6th November 2008, 06:56 PM
NAPA and Advance both carry it, along with Chemtool.

TROLLhattenschatten
6th November 2008, 08:21 PM
Slight hijack-Since I have no seafoam and nobody carries it, I was just going to decoke my engine with water. However, I figured that disconnecting the intake manifold from the the throttle body elbow and spraying water in a 2k rpm with a mister-this will prevent hydrolocking but still have the decoking benfits-no?
-Cm

Do NOT do this! i killed my work vehicle this way!

....on purpose....because it was a death-trap and they wouldn't fix it....

bkrell
6th November 2008, 10:36 PM
A few things here...


gorillajin: I think I warned you Seafoam was not spectacular and urged you try chemtool. Years of experience at work in that recommendation. Second, seat of pants is no way to judge things anyway. Did you inspect the tb to see if anything was cleaned? Did you inspect to see if it was ever dirty?

Saaboheme: good mix. However, search for the MSDS on Techron. It's a mix of naptha and Stoddard solvent (ie basic paint thinner). I know it's got a good, well-deserved rep if you can locate its components you'd save a few bucks. Gumout Regane is a better fuel system cleaner as it has (or at least had) polyether amine. I'd also recommend a bit of acetone. It will rip through deposits that this other stuff kinda grazes.

Cm452: when you start talking about water de-coking, that's stuff that's really better learned 1st hand from someone and probably tried on a vehicle you don't care too much for before branching out to a daily driver.

Cm452
6th November 2008, 11:49 PM
Alright, thanks then. I know you could hydrolock it, that's why I proposed a mister. Anyway, I ran injector cleaner and got 1.5mpg better city and like 4.5mpg better highway,so I want to complete the cleaning process.
I did hear that chemtool can destroy your rings-true?
I want to pour some in through the plug holes and let it eat away at the carbon. But how much and how do I get it out?
-CM

bkrell
7th November 2008, 12:00 AM
No, chemtool can't destroy rings. You may have seen my post where I mentioned it dissolved a painted/rubbery coating on one of my injectors but there's nothing like that in your engine. Matter of fact, I've seen it compared to other cleaners and it was fairly safe despite it's cleaning power.

The plug hole technique is for cleaning carbon off the piston crowns. This can get rid of that clattery pinging noise that is similar to what you might hear from running too low of an octane gas.

But my method is to pull the fuel pump fuse, crank the engine until the car dies, then pour a cap full of chemtool down each plug hole. Let it sit a few minutes, replace the plugs, crank the car until it dies again (the chemtool will/may make it turn over momentarily), replace the fuel pump fuse and you're done.

Joel96
8th November 2008, 09:41 PM
Ok I did the sea foam on my 96 900 with 212000 miles and it all worked just as described, the car has a smoother acceleration and nice smooth idle.:D
Now I have another question. My lifters are making a little noise, and when I accelerate hard and the car is under load, I think I here a knocking for a second or two then it goes away. :confused:

Do cars knock when they are under load?
The car burns no oil but I am about to change the oil.
Would a engine oil flush help this?
What oil do you recommend and should I do an engine flush?
Would that help remove sludge and oil that may be making the lifter noise?
Will an engine flush hurt my seals or gaskets?
If I do an engine flush what product should I use?
I know I can use sea foam but are there any others.
Thank you guys you have been extremely helpful and I appreciate all your input as it all is very good.
Thank you, Joel

bkrell
8th November 2008, 09:55 PM
Do cars knock when they are under load?

It's not knocking. It's pinging. It's from carbon buildup on your pistons or too low an octane gas. I suggest you have more work to do with your Seafoam.


The car burns no oil but I am about to change the oil.


Huh?



Would a engine oil flush help this?

No



What oil do you recommend and should I do an engine flush?


Tons of info on oil at the top of the workshop page.



Would that help remove sludge and oil that may be making the lifter noise?


It's not sludge


Will an engine flush hurt my seals or gaskets?

Possibly


If I do an engine flush what product should I use?

None. Use Auto-RX instead. Expensive but works better and a LOT safer. But again, oil doesn't sound like it's your problem.


I know I can use sea foam but are there any others.

Gunk, Berryman Chemtool. But they aren't going to do much.

Joel96
8th November 2008, 10:25 PM
Ok Thanks for the good info. I am changing the oil because I am at 3000 miles.
So do I use the chem tool method of a capful down the plug holes?
Do I have to remove the feul pump fuse?
Can I just put the pugs in and start it?
Can use the chem tool in the vacume line like seafoam?
Where can I find autorx?
Thanks, Joel

bkrell
8th November 2008, 11:47 PM
So do I use the chem tool method of a capful down the plug holes?

Yes. IF the problem is carbon on the pistons, that will cure it. If it doesn't, you might have something more serious going on.


Do I have to remove the feul pump fuse?

Yes, remove fuel pump fuse, crank car until it dies. Then pour a cap ful down each plug hole. Crank until it dies again. Then replace fuel pump fuse and crank until it runs normal.

Can use the chem tool in the vacume line like seafoam?

You can, and it may have certain advantages for intake valves, but I like this better for making sure a good concentration of solvent gets on the piston. With the vacuum technique, you're just getting a mist that instantly vaporizes just like gasoline. Gasoline is a solvent. You get the picture.....

Where can I find autorx?

Only at Auto-rx.com. The inventor is a guy who worked for years in the printing industry that starting suffering health issues that he strongly believes were related to years of exposure to the solvents they use to clean the printing machines. He researched several safer ester-based alternatives to see if any would do the trick. He found a formula and somehow or another found that with a little alteration to make it function with motor oil, it would make a great sludge cleaner. He only sells the stuff on his website and a lot of folks swear by it, including me. It's not a flush, you add it to your oil and run it a thousand miles or so, then run a short oil change without it. Then repeat if necessary. It won't thin out your oil and dissolve too much crud at once, which could clog up your oil screen.

Joel96
9th November 2008, 01:43 AM
I will order some autoRx but that will take some time to arrive. So before I change my oil tomorrow I am wondering if pouring 1/3 of the seafoam in my oil will damage my seals or cause problems. Anyone have any experience with seafoam in the crankcase?
Seafoam claims to dissolve sludge right? Is it better than the oil flush treatments you can get at napa or autozone? I just do not want to damage seals or cause leaks. :o
I will use the chemtool in the plug holes, but where is the fuel pump fuse?:confused:
Just to be sure you are saying you can use the chemtool in the vac line just like the seafoam? Is it the same amount? Does this produce the same burnoff white smoke. Thanks, Joel

bkrell
9th November 2008, 02:02 AM
If you so wish, you can use seafoam in the crankcase. It is not going to be miraculous, though. Nothing is. Just don't use more than half a bottle. When your auto-rx arrives, just go ahead and dump it in the oil you put in tomorrow. It would be best if you use a "group III" synthetic like Pennzoil Platinum, or Valvoline if you can. It will help Auto-RX clean. Yes, you can use Chemtool like Seafoam. The difference between the two is Seafoam has some thicker, oilier solvents in them that can be less effective. Chemtool's solents are good and thin and don't inhibit the cleaning process. Your fuel pump fuse should be in the fusebox on the driver's side of the dash. Pull off the cover and it will tell you which fuse is which.

lms
9th November 2008, 12:01 PM
Yes. IF the problem is carbon on the pistons, that will cure it. If it doesn't, you might have something more serious going on.




Yes, remove fuel pump fuse, crank car until it dies. Then pour a cap ful down each plug hole. Crank until it dies again. Then replace fuel pump fuse and crank until it runs normal.



You can, and it may have certain advantages for intake valves, but I like this better for making sure a good concentration of solvent gets on the piston. With the vacuum technique, you're just getting a mist that instantly vaporizes just like gasoline. Gasoline is a solvent. You get the picture.....



Only at Auto-rx.com. The inventor is a guy who worked for years in the printing industry that starting suffering health issues that he strongly believes were related to years of exposure to the solvents they use to clean the printing machines. He researched several safer ester-based alternatives to see if any would do the trick. He found a formula and somehow or another found that with a little alteration to make it function with motor oil, it would make a great sludge cleaner. He only sells the stuff on his website and a lot of folks swear by it, including me. It's not a flush, you add it to your oil and run it a thousand miles or so, then run a short oil change without it. Then repeat if necessary. It won't thin out your oil and dissolve too much crud at once, which could clog up your oil screen.



He lives where I use to live and when I ordered it for the first time a couple years ago, he hand delivered it to my door. Great guy.

Joel96
9th November 2008, 09:52 PM
Did the chemtool treatment today in the plug holes. Was very easy, did not take not much time. Thanks for the chemtool advice, The car runs great. I will check it out more tomorrow on my way to work.

bkrell
9th November 2008, 09:59 PM
Good deal. Get a good drive in and let us know.

Joel96
11th November 2008, 04:27 PM
today I noticed my check engine light is on.:o The car is running great good power good smooth idel, sid says 28.6 mpg after my commute to work. I think the light came on after I did the sea foam treatment and the chemtool in the plug holes. Anyone know if this is a common happening and how to fix it. If I disconnect the battery will it reset? Thanks, Joel

bkrell
11th November 2008, 05:50 PM
Get it read! Autozone or most parts places will do it for free.

Joel96
11th November 2008, 06:45 PM
today I noticed my check engine light is on.:o The car is running great good power good smooth idel, sid says 28.6 mpg after my commute to work. I think the light came on after I did the sea foam treatment and the chemtool in the plug holes. Anyone know if this is a common happening and how to fix it. If I disconnect the battery will it reset? Thanks, Joel

OK CEL is off. Here is what I did:

check gas cap cel still on:confused:
changed the spark plugs cel still on:confused:
disconnected the ground on the battery for 10 min. cel is off!:D
Car is running fine not sure if I will do the sea foam in the future. Probably just stick with the chemtool method.
Thanks for all the info. :D

bkrell
11th November 2008, 07:39 PM
Disconnecting the battery just reset the computer. If the problem is still there, it will pop back on. Seafoam is a TAD oilier than chemtool and perhaps that coated an o2 sensor or something. Or, maybe all the crud from your combustion chambers is caught in the cat. Either way, it should burn off eventually... If that's the issue.

But you want to take every CEL seriously. It might be a misfire indicative of a soon to fail DIC. If you have a trionic car...

Joel96
13th November 2008, 08:09 PM
Check engine light is off. But today coming home the car began to surge.:o Thought about the evaporator canister purge valve, or gas cap. Unplugged the purge valve (I think) and no check engine light came on.:confused: took the car out to test it and the car kept stalling, it never stalled before. I finally got it home and put everything back on the way it was then took the car out again and had no problems?:confused: I have searched through most of the forums and I found lots of good info on similar problems with the purge valve but not how to clean them. Can someone tell me how to clean this? by the way the car did this once before, so I do not think it has anything to do with the chemtool or seafoam treatments.
Any directions or a photo of where the purge valve is located on the 96 900s 2.3 would be really appreciated, I just want to be sure.
Thank you, Joel